Where is my VIN

[NYNick]

Missie, hopefully some Massachusetts FAQ'ers who know their way around a car and the local laws will try to help you out. 

 

Come on guys!!!

[Missie]

1 hour ago, NYNick said:

Missie, hopefully some Massachusetts FAQ'ers who know their way around a car and the local laws will try to help you out. 

 

Come on guys!!!

Thank you!  I could

use all the help I can get.  I did contact my divorce atty to see what I should do also but I doubt he knows car laws, it’s not his specialty, but maybe can help me recoup the loss.  I’ll probably hear from him after the holiday.   I had it appraised at $14,000.  Now that I have that obvious VIN stamped on the frame, I don’t feel I can fix it up and drive it at all.  It’s obvious the title doesn’t match.  I’m trying to find all the discrepancies I can.  So bummed, it’s just not right.

 Thanks again.  

[Hans]

What does "tacked on" mean? is the VIN on the fender stamped into the metal of the car?

Here in Ontario one can go to a Notary and sign an affidavit to try to sort out with original VIN. Question of what Mass wants to issue new title.

Edited July 2, 2023 by Hans
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[bergie33]

I would contact your DMV and give them the VIN from above the fender. Have them see if it's in the system. If not, see what the process is to title a vehicle that's fallen out of the system. Here in Utah all you have to do is have a Vin inspection done by the DMV or a police officer, fill out the paperwork and they title it. The vin above the fender is the one I would go with. Get a new vin plate stamped for the engine compartment and just remove the vin plate from the steering column pad. Really, the stamped vin on the body is the one that matters most. Basically you would be titling it as a separate vehicle from the title you already have. 

Edited July 2, 2023 by bergie33

[calw]

10 minutes ago, bergie33 said:

I would contact your DMV and give them the VIN from above the fender. Have them see if it's in the system. If not, see what the process is to title a vehicle that's fallen out of the system. Here in Utah all you have to do is have a Vin inspection done by the DMV or a police officer, fill out the paperwork and they title it. The vin above the fender is the one I would go with. Get a new vin plate stamped for the engine compartment and just remove the vin plate from the steering column pad. Really, the stamped vin on the body is the one that matters most. Basically you would be titling it as a separate vehicle from the title you already have. 

Right...  unless there has been major sheet metal surgery in that area of the body, the number stamped into the steel of the fender that you found under the sticker is the true, legitimate VIN of the car. 

 

Unlike modern cars with the VIN stamped on lots of parts, There were VIN's marked in only three other places on these old cars-

1. The plate near the above stamped number which is held on by two rivets (easily swapped but not innocently IMHO).

2.  The steering wheel pad (the pad is installed with two long screws from the underside, sometimes innocently swapped because of the condition of the original pad, decayed like many of our dashboards).

3. The number on the engine (often different that the car's VIN due to honest engine replacement with a used engine from another car- the odds are that that number on your car's engine is different than the true VIN or #1 and #2 for that reason

 

Logically speaking, a VIN inspector would believe the true VIN and ignore the others, but I'd just remove the incorrect parts to avoid a squabble over obviously swapped components if I were getting an inspection.  I'd feel no shame in installing a new VIN plate to replace the incorrect one either, if it matches the body stamping but I have no idea of the legality of doing that.  The steering wheel pad isn't even riveted on so it's being missing shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, logic and VIN inspectors need not be in the same universe depending on your location...

[Son of Marty]

I guess I don't see the real problem, you have a Mass title assumed to be valid, why would they do a inspection?  I would put the sticker back and play like Sgt Schutz "I see nothing- I know nothing" the chance that a inspector would know all thw Vin locations on a 40 some year old car is very slim.😈

[Gordon]

Missie, stamped VIN plate are available if you choose to go that route.  

Classic BMW VIN Plates (Stamped)

SHOP.COUPEKING.COM

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It’s impossible to do a nice engine bay restoration without refreshing the VIN plate. These...

 

[Hans]

19 minutes ago, Son of Marty said:

I guess I don't see the real problem, you have a Mass title assumed to be valid, why would they do a inspection?  I would put the sticker back and play like Sgt Schutz "I see nothing- I know nothing" the chance that a inspector would know all thw Vin locations on a 40 some year old car is very slim.😈

Errr...a knowledgeable buyer would quickly find the ruse. Or the insurance company. I would get it back to original VIN and deal with missing plate. 

[Son of Marty]

I was thinking she wanted to hold on to the car, I was also assuming the covered Vin was hot, otherwise why would someone change the Vin on a 75?

[Mark92131]

13 minutes ago, Son of Marty said:

otherwise why would someone change the Vin on a 75?

 

Too rusty to save 75 with title and nicer 75 (hot?) with no title?  Swap the riveted on VIN plate and license plates between the 2 cars, put a sticker over the stamped VIN on the body and keep paying the registration fees.

 

Mark92131

[Son of Marty]

14 minutes ago, Mark92131 said:

Too rusty to save 75 with title and nicer 75 (hot?) with no title? 

Something like that.

[Conserv]

4 hours ago, Son of Marty said:

I was thinking she wanted to hold on to the car, I was also assuming the covered Vin was hot, otherwise why would someone change the Vin on a 75?

It was a 48-year-old car without a title, while the owner was simultaneously holding, or had access to, or knew a guy with, a title for another, probably rusted-out or wrecked, ‘75. I believe the chances of it being a hot VIN are slim to none.

 

In states where you can transfer ownership of an old vehicle without a title — e.g., Georgia, Maine (two that I happen to know first-hand) — such VIN swaps don’t need to happen. But in strict “title-only” states, you’ve essentially got a parts car if you can’t get a title. And getting a new title may require you to (a.) know the name of the former owner, (b.) know the state in which he/she titled the car, and (c.) get him/her to sign a form — good luck with that if he’s/she’s dead!

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

SORRY, Mark: you just answered this question!

 

[Conserv]

The rules vary dramatically from state to state: from re-using the original VIN to having a brand new (modern) VIN assigned.

 

This is why I call it a project for someone: you can likely get a new title, but it might take some — or even a long — time. It might be relatively easy, or it might be a total pain in the butt.

 

Regards,

 

Steve

 

[Conserv]

I remain curious about the engine number: Same as the original chassis VIN? Same as the title? Neither of the above?

 

Regards,

 

Steve

 

[bluehills2002]

I live in Massachusetts and was able to obtain a title for a 2002 I purchased without one.  The process is as Bergie described above. You need to fill out a form, which I think you can find on the RMV website, then a police officer has to come out to verify the Vin and the mileage.  You will also need some document to show you are the true owner, probably something certified by the probate court. The officer will have been born 30 years after the car was made, so you’ll have to point out to him where the VIN  is found.  If the VIN  on the engine block matches the fender, I would probably feel comfortable that that is the “true” VIN.  Before you start down that road, you could also do a search of that VIN  using this form and see if you recognize the prior owner name.   if you live anywhere near Boston, I will come out and check the VIN on the engine block for you, it only takes two minutes ((I love a mystery).   Tom