Engine out – suck it up & do subframe bushings?

[mgben]

https://www.bmw2002faq.com/articles.html/technical-articles/suspension-and-steering/

Also good reading 

http://www.cyclopticgaze.com/2002/index.html

And yes from your other post the welding of the motor mount reinforcement I found easiest out of the car. 

(but opens more work for steering shaft joint etc.) And like said I did the Idler arm bushings. 

Used an air chisel to drive them out and the online procedure all thread install. 

 

[danco_]

If you’re staying with 13” tires, 

poly is encouraged around both the front control arm bushings, rear trailing arms, and sway bars. 
 

Trust me on this. It’s NICE. Makes driving a dream. Sporty but not harsh at all. 
 

I’ve gone through every type of suspension known to 2002s and a nice stock-ish set up with just a bit of poly is the sweet spot. 
 

 

 

stay away from poly in places like thrust arms, rear subframe bushings, and engine mounts. Those are no-go zones. 

[tdskip]

Thanks for the responses.

 

As I don’t have any history driving this car I really have no idea if the existing aubframe bushings are old as dirt or maybe fresh. Is there a way to tell?

 

@danco_ - is there a brand of poly bushing you would recommend?

 

[danco_]

27 minutes ago, tdskip said:

Thanks for the responses.

 

As I don’t have any history driving this car I really have no idea if the existing aubframe bushings are old as dirt or maybe fresh. Is there a way to tell?

 

@danco_ - is there a brand of poly bushing you would recommend?

 

Not that I'm aware of. I have owned two cars with them already installed, so I've never actually installed them myself. But I'll say that they drive fantastic.

 

I know IE sells what you'll likely need. Beyond that, I'm not sure. 

 

[tdskip]

Thanks @danco_

['76mintgrün'02]

18 hours ago, tdskip said:

As I don’t have any history driving this car I really have no idea if the existing aubframe bushings are old as dirt or maybe fresh. Is there a way to tell?

 

Wash them and look closely.

 

Mine were obviously original. 

 

The control arms were a bit bent up so I bought new arms, with the bushings installed; back when they were much cheaper. 

 

 

I regret tossing the old control arms in the scrap bin.  It would have been easy to straighten them out.

 

Tom

 

 

[tdskip]

Thanks - will drop the subframe on Saturday and report back.

[tdskip]

On 6/28/2020 at 8:05 PM, Dudeland said:

Do the idler arm bushings.  You can't do them with the motor in as far as I can tell.  It is either motor out or subframe dropped. 

 

 

https://www.iemotorsport.com/product/steering-idler-arm-bushings-2002/

Good morning, hope the weekend has been a good one so far.

 

If I am understanding the parts diagrams correctly I need four of the idler arm bushings, a top and bottom per side, correct?

 

URO bushings OK for these or stick with BMW OEM? (Ducking for cover now).

 

 Thanks!

[tdskip]

On 6/27/2020 at 9:08 AM, TobyB said:

For the bushings in the subframe itself-

 

you can use washers (finding the correct size isn't trivial) with a 

center hole larger than the inner sleeve to act as snubbers.

A stack about 4-6mm thick will take most of the free movement

out of the bushing, but still let it pivot and not add any real NVH.

 

This keeps the tension arm located more precisely front- to back, which in turn will

reduce caster change under braking, which lets you run a little less toe 

AND it'll be more directionally stable under braking.

 

Before you install the bushings, take one with you to the hardware store.  I think

the washers I found were for use in concrete forming, but anything with an 

ID that fits over the inner sleeve of the bushing will work.

 

I thought I was clever thinking that up, but later, a parts car that had

been through the ownership of a BMW mechanic had a very similar set of spacers installed.

 

The same thing can be done at the tension rod to control arm bushing, but there's less free movement,

and a greater potential for metal- to- metal contact if you can't find a useful diameter washer.

 

less unwanted lateral suspension movement is always good,

t

 

@TobyB and @Son of Marty - finished the engine mount reinforcement and was re-reading the threads to make sure I got it all and this is stil an open item. So even with Poly bush frame bushings there is still some room for movement that the washers help eliminate to make sure that there is a minimum of slop in the suspension? The washers go between the bolt head and bushing when it is all put back together?

[tomphot]

1 hour ago, tdskip said:

Good morning, hope the weekend has been a good one so far.

 

If I am understanding the parts diagrams correctly I need four of the idler arm bushings, a top and bottom per side, correct?

 

URO bushings OK for these or stick with BMW OEM? (Ducking for cover now).

 

 Thanks!

For the steering idler arm bushing that you have a link for in your question, you need 1.  It comes in 2 pieces that are pressed together.  The other idler arm is attached to the steering box.

[tech71]

2 hours ago, tdskip said:

Good morning, hope the weekend has been a good one so far.

 

If I am understanding the parts diagrams correctly I need four of the idler arm bushings, a top and bottom per side, correct?

 

URO bushings OK for these or stick with BMW OEM? (Ducking for cover now).

 

 Thanks!

Probably no need to change those.

I have owned several 02s over the years and had subframes out on 3 at this point.

Twice I have changed idler arm bushings and twice, there was no need.

They seem to be indestructible.

Did all bushings  on Survivors subframe except idler arm. It was tight.

[tdskip]

Good morning and thanks for the responses. Do I basically check for play to see if it needs to be touched?

[g_force]

7 minutes ago, tdskip said:

Do I basically check for play to see if it needs to be touched?

 

Yes, if you have the subframe out, lever on the arm and look/feel for movement that shouldn't be there.

[NYNick]

It's a 46 year old car. Do the idler arm bushing.

[URO Parts Support]

On 7/19/2020 at 5:50 AM, tdskip said:

URO bushings OK for these or stick with BMW OEM?

 

Hi Tdskip, we sell about 100 of bushing 32 21 1 115 116 annually, and haven't had any returns or complaints about them in the last 12 months (engineering archives data older than 12 months).  Our bushings are high-density PE with a steel sleeve, just like OEM.

Edited July 21, 2020 by URO Parts Support