Another Rust Discussion

[Stevenhy92]

Hello,

 

Before I get into this I just want to say that this will be a lengthy post because I'm a complete idiot..

 

After a lot of research on what to check when buying an 02 and all. I still made the stupid mistake of NOT checking for the main rust spots. This was my first 02 buying experience and I was just overly excited and it wasn't til a few days later that I remembered to check all these spots. With that being said, I had already paid the guy for the car. So here I am, stuck with a car that needs quite a bit of body work and I need to take responsibility for being stupid. I am looking at the brighter side of things, and I keep telling myself this will be an expensive, stressful, LEARNING process, and hopefully I'll value the car more when I finish it in a million years..

 

Trust me, I am hating myself for this and I should've prepared a check list when I went to go look at it. I already feel stupid, so I'd appreciate just some solid advice as I have been bashing myself the last few weeks. Since then, I've been researching on here and youtube for various things. Basically how to fix rust, and other body work, also looking into seeing if there are going to be any local workshops for body work. I am willing to learn how to do it because I can only imagine the kind of money I will be paying a shop to do all the work I need done. As far as I know there is rust on the Rockers, Spare wheel well (can see right through it), rear Fenders, doors, and shock towers. I've poked around everywhere that I could remember, and the floor board from under the car seemed okay, again I could be wrong because it was hard to get all the carpet and other crap from inside to really check. 

 

My main question is how to go about the rear shock towers, a fellow member on here is willing to cut out his shock tower panels but we are just curious on the best way to do it (how he should go about cutting it, and me welding it in) Advise me, if you think it could just use some patch work or not. For the other stuff, I was thinking of getting replacement parts from various websites that you guys have mentioned on this forum.

 

Here are some of my current plans for the restoration (Give me some feedback and any other suggestions please)

 

1. Install replacement parts I already have (Hood, and front fenders) 

 

2. Buy shock tower panel cut outs, or patch work (depending on what you guys think.)

 

3. For the rear fenders, future plan is to add flares all around so I figured that will just be getting cut out anyways.

 

4. For the spare wheel well, I honestly was just thinking of doing the Garagistic E30 spare wheel well delete that they have and just keeping the spare in the trunk anyways. (Is the spare wheel well a structural piece?)

 

5. For the doors, I have access to a guy local with two doors in good condition for a good price. (Replace both doors or do patch work?)

 

6. Buy the rockers, floor panels, trunk floor, and shock tower panels and anything else needed on websites like Restoration-design, and 2002ad, etc. 

 

PS car is being picked up by mechanic from the sellers house and the motor is being installed in a week or two, my main goal was to get it running and enjoy the car with my family, but I also realized I need it to be structurally safe before then.

 

I'll create a google photos link with as many pics as I can add. 

 

Thanks for your feedback and I'm glad I have been able to learn quite a bit of other things on this forum. 

 

https://photos.app.goo.gl/apmCRdGCwvNyp7AK6

[VWJake]

It ain’t great, but I’m in the process of fixing worse. ? Check my blogs if you don’t believe me. ?

 

The floor pans don’t look horrible. Could be some separation between the rocker and pan though. Get that drain plug flattened out, cleaned up, painted, seam sealed or cut it out and weld in a patch. 
 

I could go on and on, but let’s get to the basics...

 

check the frame rails. If they’ve got holes in the bottoms you should fix them before piling the family in for joy rides. The shock towers are patchable, not a safety concern at that stage. The spare tire well/tire is part of the crash worthiness of the car. Keep em and fix em unless you’re building a track car. With the amount if rust in the aft portions of the rockers and the leading edges of the wheel wells you need to be concerned about the subframe pick up points. If they’re rotten don’t put your family in that car until it’s fixed properly. Replace the outer rockers and evaluate the inners once the outlets are off. Plan on A sheets too. With those things fixed you could enjoy it as a rough runner/driver safely. 
 

Order the outer nose skin and look at Jaymic for the inner parts too. I think you’ll need them as well. Possibly a whole nose. 
 

Your wallet could be pretty dusty inside after fixing this car. I’m not telling you not to do it, but I’d be lying to you if I said it was going to be cheap to fix up. I can see an easy 5-10k in a shop to repair all of that rust.

[Conserv]

Major project!

Have I seen worse? You bet. Much worse. But that doesn’t make this ‘02 any less of a project.

 

@VWJake — as someone who, over time, has brought back worse cars —was just the right person to comment on this car. Please listen to him!

 

Since you obviously didn’t notice the readily-visible rust, you should also, as soon as possible, examine the less visible spots: bases of the A pillars, front frame rails, and, you should remove the rear seat and examine the areas surrounding the two rear subframe mounts.
 

After you’ve truly examined, and poked at — with a screwdriver or equivalent — all the rusty spots, you need to honestly evaluate whether this is a car worth investing in. Don’t throw good money after bad money.

 

Regards,

 

Steve

 

 

 

[Stevenhy92]

Thanks guys, I’ll thoroughly check it once it’s back from getting the motor installed and in my presence. I know I’m in over my head on this, but I do want to get it structurally safe overall and I am in no way of rushing that. Definitely going to be a learning experience ?

[Stevenhy92]

Also, @VWJake where can I find your blogs? Thanks 

[MitchaPaLoOza88]

7 minutes ago, Stevenhy92 said:

Thanks guys, I’ll thoroughly check it once it’s back from getting the motor installed and in my presence. I know I’m in over my head on this, but I do want to get it structurally safe overall and I am in no way of rushing that. Definitely going to be a learning experience ?

 

If you are going to be doing body work. Why are you putting the motor back in the car?

Its much easier to manipulate/work-on the car without the motor.

[Stevenhy92]

22 minutes ago, MitchaPaLoOza88 said:

 

If you are going to be doing body work. Why are you putting the motor back in the car?

Its much easier to manipulate/work-on the car without the motor.

You’re right, I’m not opposed to getting most of the body work done by a shop either, so I may hold off on getting the motor installed cause it’s not a bad idea. But I do want to learn and tackle some stuff myself If I can. I did sell my truck so no car payment and I paid all my debt off in May so there’s funds for either route I go. I do want to learn though since I don’t do anything else but work lol I just want to take care of the structural stuff first so I can drive it and enjoy it even just a little bit and not wait ten years haha. 

[VWJake]

1 hour ago, Stevenhy92 said:

Also, @VWJake where can I find your blogs? Thanks 

I don’t know how to show you where to find them so here’s links for both of mine. 

 

There are tons of great blogs on this site about others restoration/repair adventures. Read as many as you can stand. There’s a wealth of info here.

 

[VWJake]

Well that didn’t work... 

 

https://www.bmw2002faq.com/blogs/blog/354-from-the-ashes-breathing-new-life-into-a-neglected-73-02/

 

https://www.bmw2002faq.com/blogs/blog/246-resurrection-of-a-68-02/

[MitchaPaLoOza88]

1 hour ago, Stevenhy92 said:

You’re right, I’m not opposed to getting most of the body work done by a shop either, so I may hold off on getting the motor installed cause it’s not a bad idea. But I do want to learn and tackle some stuff myself If I can. I did sell my truck so no car payment and I paid all my debt off in May so there’s funds for either route I go. I do want to learn though since I don’t do anything else but work lol I just want to take care of the structural stuff first so I can drive it and enjoy it even just a little bit and not wait ten years haha. 

 

Totally get the excitement, just make a plan for yourself and how you want to go about restoring it (aka how far you wanna take it).

 

Just a piece of advice, "just the structural stuff" opens up a snowball effect of how far to take the restoration.

 

For example, replacing the rocker panels means you have to cut the rear lower quarter of the body as well. And if you do that, you are probably going to want to at the very least primer it. Primer won't protect the car very long on the road and you'll be back to doing it again when it rusts. Think a few steps ahead so you don't end up doing work twice.

[jk16vturbo]

I think I may need to talk to VW Jake as I made the same mistake several years ago after bilateral hip surgery.  I believed the rust was as the seller stated and most areas did not look that bad.  I was unable to crawl under the car at three weeks post surgery so I used a mirror to the best of my ability and failed miserably.  Good thing is that I only traded even for a rusty 4000 Quattro that I fixed up from a $300 dollar beater into a driver.  

 

I am currently buying complete rear wheel wells, rockers, front lower A pillars and possibly more.  I jacked up the car on the drivers side and the front floor crumbled.  I already have the floor pans and three spare doors.  The next thing that I am seriously looking at is a rotisserie.  Its expensive but can save you a lot of time and possibly from an early death if you can afford it.  A wooden Tiptissorie is another option and VW Vortex has a lot of how too's on building one.  

 

I believe the only reason that I am willing to go to this length and not just scrap it is because it has a VAC built race engine and was used for years in SCCA.  It's a 1976 so not the most valuable car but I want to make something that I am not so worried about driving or getting a door ding or even bumped into.  Good luck with your restoration as I am now going to follow this thread.  

[Son of Marty]

You ask about order of repair so IMHO don't even think about starting to bolt on your new/good used parts until your closer to the end, you'll be taking off parts for a while you need space to weld and align the new parts and rust proof them after you get them in keep the engine on the shop floor also. Get your self a good name brand  mig welder with gas, no flux core, used is fine but you need parts support for the unit, 110v will do everything you need a 220v is better but more $$$$. I'd start with the spare tire well measure the diameter and head for the pick and pull you should find something to replace yours. The few shots of the doors look like they could be patched but you won't know until you can see the inside. 

Edited July 31, 2020 by Son of Marty

[jerry]

you've been given good advice so far so there is not much more to add.  practice doing butt welds with a MIG welder.  sheetmetal from old metal cabinets, washing machines or shelving is a good source of mild steel repair metal.  as for your spare tire well, it looks like the damage is primarily on one side.  make a patch panel, or two or three using the intact side to shape your patches. 

a cheap panel beater pad can be made by filling up a zip-lock baggie with sand (about 2/3rds to 3/4 full) then wrap it all up using gorilla tape or similar tape, till the baggie is completely wrapped and no exposed baggie.  it will work just as well as the fancy leather ones sold on Eastwood.  youtube is filled with helpful methods of working sheetmetal.  have fun.

[TobyB]

Go shell- shopping.

 

If something good turns up, that's your answer. 

 

In the mean time, start taking

what you have apart, and see how it goes.  The nose being removed is... a bit daunting,

given that you will probably be replacing rockers, rear subframe mounting points, inner rear fenders....

it's a lot of re- creation, from the looks of it.

 

We had acquired at least 3 cars by the time I got the 'first' one 'finished'... at least one looked like that!

 

t

 

[Mike Self]

Truth be told, the rockers, rear wheel well lips and rear inner wheel arches were much worse on my '69 after 30 Ohio winters.  Not to mention the door bottoms, front fenders, lower front and rear valences, etc etc.  I took evening auto body classes at our local vocational school for several years and learned how to do most of the bodywork  that had to be replaced/repaired.  After I did most of the body work, I left the painting to a professional shop but it turned out well enough to enjoy a year's vacation at the BMW CCA Foundation museum in 2019...

 

I started out at the same skill level as you, so if I can do it, so can you.

 

mike