engine and drivetrain Long Time Lurker...finally Have Some Cash To Invest...update...fresh Paint Pics!

[Fretish]

Well, I have been lurking around for a while and I finally have some decisions to make! I own a 1973 2002, which I acquired about 2 years ago. I have driven her here and there off and on in the summers in that time. She has problems of course but not beyond repair, and now I have a little cash to spend and I am looking for some opinions on how to approach this. I'm not running on an unlimited budget here but I have about 5k cad to spend. Doing something in 2 stages is what I'm looking at.

 

I will attach some pics for reference. 

 

She needs some body work, and I have  webber 40dcoe carbs, that came with her. Currently sitting on H&R sport springs. I want the car to have a great stance, lowered beyond where she is now not fully tucked but I want near 0 wheel gap....all of this without flaring her. Wheels I'm still up in the air over 15's or 16's but I will be going with a mesh BBS style wheel....this I know.

 

As for engine work, apart from the carbs I would like to switch the cam to a schrick 292 with new rockers (or possibly the IE version pending recommendation), IE sidedraft intake, upgrade distributor, tune up with plugs wires and upgraded distributor will happen either way, new exhaust Ansa or IE.

 

Now for the body, it needs a bit of work. Some rust above the signals in the top of the engine bay and a little bit under the rockers. I may have some strut tower issues in the trunk....will need to be assessed.  I'm looking to eliminate the front bumper and I'm not sure where I'm going with the rear one just yet. 

 

So with all this being said where would you start if you had 5k or so? Looking for ideas of how to go about doing all of this. I will try and do as much as possible to do the little things myself, but with limited space, time,....and mechanical knowledge, lets say 80% will be done by someone else...at a bit of a discounted rate as it would be his side project. Would be willing to space it all out over 2 years or so.

 

Thanks in advance for any ideas, knowledge and contributions!

 

 

Update March 3rd:

 

On her way to the body man!

 

 

These are the newest additions....

 

So far the plan is this....body work will be done by the contact on kijiji, should take about 4-6 weeks. I have purchased the wheels and am just waiting for Andrew at IE to get back to me on the suspension set up, also header, downpipe, and exhaust. That plus the 40 DCOE weber carb I already have will be installed after the body work but before the paint. I will be removing the front bumper and replacing the holes with a set of fogs (yet to be purchased). I am shaving off the extra front and rear signal and brake lights and I found a myster box!

 

 http://www.bmw2002faq.com/topic/151309-forgotten-mystery-box-openedwith-sexy-results/

 

And had already purchased a set of Euro tails, I now have 2! Plus some very nice spare tailights AND an LED rear light upgrade kit. I will be installing a Talbot driver side mirror on the hood and shaving the original. Lower door trim will also be shaved. Wheels will be painted gold. And other than a steering wheel that should do it for this year. That should take me to hopefully driving by Mid to late May. Lets hope it all works out!!

 

Edited August 2, 2014 by Fretish

[John_in_VA]

Enjoy it for a while longer as you save up an additional $10K or so to do it right!

[Fretish]

So you figure it will take about 10k hey? That's sort of what I was looking at for a final tally. Would doing it in 2 stages change that much? Like stance and engine, then followed by body? Thanks for the reply!

let me correct myself already.....I guess you might be talking 15K......UUUGGHHHH I just couldn't wait that long!!! hahaha

[LJtii]

The car has visible rust, which I have found over the years to be similar to icebergs - you only see the tip of the problem. Looking at your front fenders as well as the rear shock towers, I would guess your car may have more severe corrosion than you imagine, as what seems to be happening is plastic filler popping out and cracking. This means someone has already spent some time covering up the damage, rather than structurally repairing it, and $5k will not fix that and get it repainted. You might be doing yourself a favor to consult with an expert shop in your area to assess the car's legitimate needs prior to starting in on any small fixes.

[Fretish]

The car has visible rust, which I have found over the years to be similar to icebergs - you only see the tip of the problem. Looking at your front fenders as well as the rear shock towers, I would guess your car may have more severe corrosion than you imagine, as what seems to be happening is plastic filler popping out and cracking. This means someone has already spent some time covering up the damage, rather than structurally repairing it, and $5k will not fix that and get it repainted. You might be doing yourself a favor to consult with an expert shop in your area to assess the car's legitimate needs prior to starting in on any small fixes.

Well right now I'm into if for about 3500, if you're talking about 5k+ in body repair, would I be better served selling it and buying a better car for 10k?

[emmodg]

Fix your rust FIRST so you have a decent base to dump money into.

 

Everybody and his brother is going to give his or opinion on what it costs to do a restoration "right" - $10k, $20k, $30k, and on and on.... Sports Car Restoration's idea of "right" is wholly different than White Post Restoration's idea of "right" and PTG's idea of "right". They're all masters of their craft!

 

It's what YOU want the car to be. Is it an investment? Be prepared to spend some big coin and then keep your fingers crossed the market stays stable. A daily driver? Make it safe, reliable and somewhat rust free. A toy? Well...it's your call then.

 

"Right"? Fix what needs to be fixed for the car to be safe, reliable and fun for YOU. 

[Conserv]

Fix your rust FIRST so you have a decent base to dump money into.

 

Everybody and his brother is going to give his or opinion on what it costs to do a restoration "right" - $10k, $20k, $30k, and on and on.... Sports Car Restoration's idea of "right" is wholly different than White Post Restoration's idea of "right" and PTG's idea of "right". They're all masters of their craft!

 

It's what YOU want the car to be. Is it an investment? Be prepared to spend some big coin and then keep your fingers crossed the market stays stable. A daily driver? Make it safe, reliable and somewhat rust free. A toy? Well...it's your call then.

 

"Right"? Fix what needs to be fixed for the car to be safe, reliable and fun for YOU.

+1

Upgrading your suspension, stance, and engine while the car is rusting away would be a BAD approach! Those rear shock towers scare me most of that which I can see in your photos.

Steve

[02fanatic]

Some of us on here probably aren't the best source to offer advice!  HA!  The reason I am laughing is that many of us have the "passion" for these cars and money rarely enters into what we do.  Unfortunately, as time has passed (in the last 10 years anyway) cost "has" become more relevant since cost of parts has skyrocketed over recent years.

 

That all being said, in your case, since you have a '73...I'd definitely keep it!  Great year to own IMO, whether carbed or fuel injected.  You cannot beat the 1973 model year!

 

Is that color Sahara?  I assume it is, since tobacco color interior rarely came in Chamonix color '02's....I think I'm correct on this.

 

Become friends with a body shop, if you haven't already....have a shop you can trust and who would be willing to work with you "over time" to get the body rust eliminated....you don't need to dive in with both feet to restore the car all at once.  You could even pull the engine and drivetrain and be working on things while the car is in the shop.  The other option would be to keep the car drivable and have the body work done over time, as funds allow.

 

When I restored Hugo back in 2000 to 2004 (some on here will remember), he was in the body shop for right at about a year!....before that I was pulling the engine, etc, and working on paint prep myself.  Truly a labor of love....I didn't have deep pockets, but I had the "passion".  Money spent over time doesn't hurt as bad!  And hunting for parts (new & used) over time was alot of the fun of the restoration.

 

I guess I'd go through every inch of the car as best I could on my own, to evaluate the extent of the rust...your inner wheel wells may be rusted and not visable too...so some rust you won't be able to see until the car is taken apart.

 

If you like the car now, I say keep it and work on it as funds allow, and enjoy the ride ("in the car" and "during the restoration").  You won't regret the journey one bit.

 

Good luck!

 

John

Edited January 27, 2014 by 02fanatic

[bluedevils]

Don't spend money on body work. It will cost more than 10K in your car. You can get a great CA car (e.g., 1973) with all the rust issues fixed by POs and good running condition under 10k (or a clean shell for way cheaper, decent paint is cheaper than body work unless you want to enter concours). You can then spend another 5K for suspension and engine upgrades and done with it. You can sell this one for a good cash after a little bit cleaning or use it as a parts car. I never understand slamming the car too low, it must be a teenager thing. Current suspension set up looks pretty nice to me. But it is your car and cash, you can do anything you want, suggestions provided here should be used only as a basic guideline. 

[Mike Self]

As the long-time owner of a Sahara '73...you have a great car there!  That being said...

 

I agree with the folks who say to locate all the car's rust before doing anything else.  The front fender rust is most likely the result of a botched repair where the front fender is welded (the only place it's welded) to the nose panel.  From the factory that seam was leaded; either your fenders were replaced and the seam was bondo-ed--which is now popping off) or it wasn't welded at all and bondo-ed.  Same result.  If the rest of the fender isn't rusted through (trailing edge, around the turn signals) that can probably be repaired properly and the fender saved.  The right fender also has that bondo pop above the headlight, and the trailing edge is rusty below the knee moulding, so it's gonna need replacing.  Once that back edge begins to rust, it's almost impossible to repair so the repair will last.  Believe me, I've tried it!  

 

The spot in the trunk around the right rear wheel arch could be more serious.  Looks like that's also bondo popping off...you need to look underneath and see what's there (or isn't there!).  If there's a rust line where the spring perch is welded to the wheel arch, that can be repaired without too much trauma, but since it's structural it needs to be done right, with the right gauge metal.

 

I would also look carefully at the rocker panels, especially just in front of the door opening, and the section that's directly underneath the rear quarter window.  If the outer rocker is rusted through, also pull back the carpet and check the inner rocker (below the door sill); it's structural.  Check the lower front valence, under the bumper bracket holes.  Dirt packs in there, plugs the drain holes and it stays wet until the metal rusts through.  Then pull up the carpet and check the area around the pedal bucket (and the bucket itself); then look to the left of the bucket where the floorboard joins the toeboard and cowl side.  Finally, pull up the back seat and check the floor in the vicinity of the two "wells" that help support the rear crossmember.  Wouldn't hurt to check the crossmember itself for structural rust--they've been known to rust through in salt country.

 

Once you've found all the rust, take it to a body shop (presuming you're not gonna do the work yourself) and have 'em give you a price on fixing the structural stuff first, then the cosmetic stuff.  That'll give you an idea of what you're gonna get into.  Then you can decide to begin the process:  structural repair first, then cosmetic.  Make it look pretty and be assured you have a sound body.  Then go after the running gear.  Otherwise you might put lotsa $$$ into performance parts only to find out you're gonna have to transfer it to another body shell.  Then you'll get discouraged, give up the project and sell all those goodies to folks on the FAQ.  Better you have the fun!

 

cheers

mike

Edited January 28, 2014 by mike

[Fretish]

And this is why I have come here....thanks gentlemen for your knowledge and responses. I hope you realize the situation I'm in....I have a little extra cash and I'm like a Jon in a whorehouse just looking to blow my load on the first woman who looks my way! hahaha. I LOVE my girl Lily and I dont plan on letting her go, I'm also realistic and if I was planning on spending 30k-50k for a concourse vehicle...well lets say I would have a bigger bank account and car collection than I currently do. With my space limited I'm going to have to tear her down and get to the bottom of this rust situation first and progress forward from there. I'm in no way against driving her during the restoration, which is why I likely will not remove the motor etc while body work is being done. I have a few connections that should hopefully help me find an at home body man who will take in on a piece by piece basis. Unfortunately living in Edmonton Ab Canada I obsess over driving her again all winter and there would be no way I could watch her sit all summer without driving. If I would have had the extra scratch earlier I would have begun doing this earlier in the winter, and now with my Alfa Spider sold she is all I have for fun....(other than the completely mint E30 325e I just persuaded my girlfriend to purchase...pick it up tomorrow!!! super clean all original with only 65k kms) 

 

I will continue updating as I go along, but please keep leaving your comments and suggestions as all the info I can get is appreciated. I'm not a mechanic but I'm not scared to act like one, so I will enoy doing as much as possible myself....body work however I feel is an art, and I am not an artist so I will leave that to the people who know wtf they are doing. I am going to have someone look at it ASAP and go from there. In the meantime I will start removing the interior to get some better looks at the extent of the rust.

 

As for the comment about having a car lowered.....there is just something about a properly stanced 2002 that just gives me goosebumps....it just looks super aggressive and I love that!

 

Some extra pics.....

Edited January 27, 2014 by Fretish

[jerry]

...Just one word: Plastic....

[Fretish]

...Just one word: Plastic....

 

How do you mean? Like thats what I'm dealing with? or are you saying go with fiberglass replacement panels?

[thehackmechanic]

There's no easy answer to rust. 

 

You've already seen people throwing around the word "right." That word drives me crazy, because those uttering it are not a) going to come to your door with a wheelbarrow full of money or going to offer to take it into their body shop and do it for free (no offense to any poster who used the word "right"; you all know that "do it once do it right" is my "Niagra Falls" and makes me want to gag someone with a sweaty sock soaked in brake fluid).

 

Your choices are:

 

1) Do nothing. Drive it the way it is. If you keep it dry, the both of you will live a long happy life.

 

2) Save up money for a -- choose a number, $10k, $20k, $30k -- outer body restoration from a reputable shop, the result of which will leave you breathless and bankrupt.

 

3) Try to find that third way. Look on craigslist for folks who weld, do rust repair, and paint out of their garage. I got a 635CSi painted this way, including wet sanding for $800. The result wasn't a $5k paint job, but it was the best $800 paint job you ever saw. But don't kid yourself that the outcome will be the same as that of a reputable shop. It won't be. And that may be okay. Just go into it with your eyes open.

 

-Rob

[willys]

where are you located?  If you are on the left coast or close to Arizona, I would suggest Craigslist for options.  You may find that if you sell your car or part it out and buy one with only a few body and mechanical issues, you will be happier in the long run. 

 

of course if you are attached to your 73, all bets are off. 

 

Jeff