Installing New Calipers This Weekend - done - photos - questions

[73tiiDavidPA]

Been a couple / few weeks.  Son is in his senior year and there was prom (actually 3 different ones), soccer games, and life....  Finally got in the garage last weekend after a 3 week hiatus.  

 

I had bought the Motive brake bleeder and was ready to bleed and attempt to fix my stuck front passenger caliper.... or so I thought.  Screwed on the pressure bleeder, pumped it up to 15 psi, opened the rear bleeder... and nothing.  Tried the other rear brake.... nothing.  Went to fronts, Driver side bleed from 2 out of three screws, passenger side barely bleed out of 1.  I was able to push about 3 reservoirs of full clean fluid through the fronts eventually, but nothing out of the backs.

 

Read something about bleeding the brake booster under the hood before bleeding the rears.  Will have to look into that more tomorrow (waiting for my plane currently).  

 

Then I checked to see if the pistons in the front moved (I had finally gotten the brake pads out of the stuck caliper).  Yep they moved... badly.  Torn boot and only 1 piston moving from each side (one top, one bottom) on the passenger side, and two pistons on one side moving from the driver's caliper.  well... shit.  So I pulled the calipers and bit the bullet and ordered newly rebuilt ones (autozone - cardone $246, then $81 back in cores) that should be waiting for me once I get home.  

 

For giggles I'll post the messed up caliper photos I took when I'm back home - the airport lounge has pathetic wifi.  

 

I'll read up on installing new calipers and properly bleeding them before I start this weekend.  (keeping the old pads - they are barely used, and the wierd drilled rotors for now).  Any advice beyond what I can scrounge up on this site (and general "I'm an idiot and never replaced calipers" site) feel free to post.  

 

Cheers,

 

David

 

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by 73tiiDavidPA
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['76mintgrün'02]

It sounds like you are due for new flexible brake lines (4/front and 2/rear).  

 

They can look fine on the outside, but be swollen shut internally.

[Simeon]

Since you are in the US, I assume that you have a LHD car and therefore probably don't need to worry about bleeding the booster. That's for cars with remote boosters like RHDs or very early 1600's. 

[Mike Self]

+1 on the flex hoses.  If yours are original, it's definitely time for new ones.  Mine looked perfect on the outside, but I could hardly get a straightened coathanger wire through 'em once removed from the car.  You'll have the system open and the calipers off anyway, so now's the time to do the hoses, at least in the front.  The rears are real PITAs to change out unless you're dropping the subframe for other work.

 

mike

[halboyles]

1 minute ago, mike said:

The rears are real PITAs to change out

Definitely a PITA,  The trick is to cut the rubber hoses at both ends close to the 14mm hose fitting.  Then you can use a 14mm socket to unscrew the old hoses while holding the steel lines with a flare nut wrench.  If the steel lines are so rusted to the flexible lines that they twist or break, just take the whole steel line off the car and head on down to your favorite car parts place.  They should have hand-bendable steel lines close to the right length with the correct flare that you can form to fit along the trailing arm profile.  

['76mintgrün'02]

These little guys are well worth the $12, or whatever, for getting a positive grip on the fittings.  

 

Once they break free, then you can spin them off with wrenches.  Definitely DO the rears as well, since you are unable to get fluid to bleed back there. 

[TobyB]

Quote

You'll have the system open

since I've gone over to the dark side (abs pumps, INPA, etc) I've learned the value of NOT opening the system for calipers.

Apparently, it's called a "golf tee" and you get the plastic ones, and stick them into the ends of the brake lines (I had to bum some off a friend.  Golf is a color, right?)

 

For the rear lines, yeah, might as well drain it, because there's no way to do those fast and efficiently, that's for sure.

 

And yeah, if the hoses are original, even if your bleeders are plugged (about as likely as the lines being swollen shut) do change them.  50 is great for old white guys, not so much for rubber brake lines.

 

t

 

[halboyles]

Warning!  Explicit graphics.  Brake lines were harmed in the making of this documentary.

 

Just for fun here is a shot of a used but working rear brake line on the left and a non-working line on the right.  The working line was removed from a '76 that had been sitting for 12 years and the other one came from a '71 1600 that had never had it's rear lines changed evidently.  There is supposed to be a hole in the center for the brake fluid to move through.

[TobyB]

...and the oddest thing is that you can pull original hoses off 2 old, unmaintained cars, and one will look like the picture on the left, and the other will look like the picture on the right.

Different suppliers, different materials?  Changed sometime in the run, and they did a 'First in, last out' supply scheme?

 

t

 

[73tiiDavidPA]

On 5/4/2017 at 5:16 PM, '76mintgrun'02 said:

It sounds like you are due for new flexible brake lines (4/front and 2/rear).  

 

They can look fine on the outside, but be swollen shut internally.

 

Yep, the rears appear to be completely blocked.  I installed the rebuilt front calipers today.  Bleed the system (twice) and attempted to bleed the rears twice with no success.  No fluid coming out of the rears with the self bleeder pumped up to 20 psi.  The front both bleed fine, and overall I have pushed about a quart of brake fluid through the system - so at least what's in there is nice and clean.  

 

Here are photos of the dead calipers I took off (love the one torn top and one bottom working

 

 

At least one side is working here... but still no joy in this

 

 

Shiny and new (well rebuilt at least).  Cardone, fit fine, no stripped threads, no rubbing, happy from what others have posted

 

 

Gotta love old baking pans,  excellent excuse to make the wife happy with new ones and relegate the old to the garage.  

 

 

 

And some very nice previous owner put flexible stainless steel lines up front

 

 

Am I correct in assuming there are no other flexible lines in the front that I need to replace?

 

And now for the rears.... again it appears there are nice stainless lines - on the top - the line that feeds to top of the brake (easier to see in the second photo)

 

 

 

So the line on the left, the top line, is hard, then turns to a flexible stainless.  The line on the right, the lower line, appears to be rubber (though its so hard it seems like a metal line.  Are those the lines I need to replace?  Yes, they seem line a PITA, and I'll need to buy several yards of line.  More research for tomorrow.  

 

On the good side, I started her up, pulled her out of the garage... and the pedal went to the floor, ha!  Happily my back yard is about 3/4 of an acre and I pulled her back in the garage gingerly and use the e-brake to stop.  I re-bleed the fronts again and the magic, then worked.  The pedal still is a bit soft, and doesn't engage immediately, but the brakes are there.  

 

My son and I took a recon trip and were able to steer, shift, stop, and go.  Excellent!  I'm lucky in that there is a fortune 500 headquarters 200 yards from my house with several nice little side streets that have no traffic on the weekends.  

 

I'll keep people posted about the rears, looks like a trip to the auto parts store (I do have to return my caliper cores anyway) for some brake hose and then some quality time attempting to do the rears and bleeding it all over again.  Thanks for everyone's comments and tips on the rears, I'll have them on hand tomorrow when I take it all apart again.  

 

Cheers!

 

 

['76mintgrün'02]

Did you consider what Toby said about the rear wheel cylinders' bleeders being clogged?

perhaps you should twist them all the way out and make sure they are clear.

 

Your photos of the bits in the rear are too dark for me to see very well, but if the flex lines look like the ones up front, chances are that they are not swollen shut.

 

The boxed tii trailing arms have a fitting built in, which grips the 14mm end of the flex line.  That should make them easier to remove/install than on non-boxed arms.  (not that I have ever done it, mind you).

 

Your new calipers sure are pretty.

 

You are making good progress : )

[jgerock]

I would limit pumping the pressure in the power bleeder above 10 psi. You can blow the hoses off the reservoir, especially if there aren't any hose clamps.

 

 

[JerryC]

4 hours ago, jgerock said:

I would limit pumping the pressure in the power bleeder above 10 psi. You can blow the hoses off the reservoir, especially if there aren't any hose clamps.

 

 

Sounds like the voice of experience.