Build Thread - Rogue Fab's 1972 BMW 2002 Race E10 Resto Mod

[RogueFab]

Hey fellow 2002 fans. We (my shop and I) have decided to build a pretty wild BMW 2002. We are starting with a not super clean 1972 (non Tii) model. Car had likely rolled the ODO once, as the seats/pedals/steering wheel showed very little wear for a 2xx,xxx mile car. Looked more like 1xx,xxx to me. 

 

We are holding the details a little close and dropping them in our build videos on YouTube. So far we have released the first 2 videos. We gutted the car and diagnosed the rust on it. It is a little heavy in the driver's floor and driver's rocker, but the battery area is surprisingly clean. We will be repairing all the rust of course. This car had been wrecked a few times and had a LOT of lead and bondo nearly everywhere (the hood is incredibly clean, as is the roof). 

 

Build Details released so far:

Body/Chassis: 1972 BMW 2002 - This will be a widebody build

Suspension: E46 based subframes and arms

Coilovers: WAY newer than E46, check out episode 2!

Braking system: Giant track worthy setup, NOT made by BMW. Watch our build series for the reveal.

Engine: TBA (likely episode 4 or 5, it will be over 300 whp)

Transmission: TBA (likely episode 3, 5 or 6 speed manual, baby!)

Differential: TBA (likely episode 4 or 5)

Target budget: $10,000 goal all-in including safety equipment and vehicle purchase!

 

If you want to support the build, there are 2 ways:

1. Watch our YouTube videos all the way through and leave a comment and a thumbs up!

2. If you are looking for E10 parts, we have some parts for sale. I will make a post about them soon! This build will take over a year and will be a road-worthy car that is definitely track focused with sanctioning rules met (full cage, fire suppression, fuel cell, etc). 

 

Also, I know these aren't officially an "E10" chassis. That is a common nickname, and we are using it

 

Video 1: Teardown and engine revival attempt. The engine is worth way more running... but can we get there without investing too much time and money to make it worth it?! Watch to find out.

 

 

 

 

Video 2: Front suspension fabrication and layout. We reveal the wheel and tire setup (though we don't actually say the size... they are 275 wide!). We also discover an issue with our front suspension design and pledge to correct it in episode 3. We also cut a few more sections of sheet metal out of the car and drop the E10 rear subframe out.

 

 

Edited February 14 by RogueFab

[popovm]

@RogueFab I was with you until the goofy faked shocked face youtuber thumbnail. 😆 Half kidding, just a pet peeve of mine. Will be checking out your vids. Consider giving back to this community with some interaction and sharing of technicals. Hopefully this isn't pop in and pop out scenario just to boost your channel. 

[RogueFab]

9 minutes ago, popovm said:

@RogueFab I was with you until the goofy faked shocked face youtuber thumbnail. 😆 Half kidding, just a pet peeve of mine. Will be checking out your vids. Consider giving back to this community with some interaction and sharing of technicals. Hopefully this isn't pop in and pop out scenario just to boost your channel. 

 

Yeah if dumb facial expressions didn't get clicks, I wouldn't make them! 

 

This isn't some kind of pump-and-dump scheme. This is going to be a 1000+ hour car build that I plan to hang on to personally. In my past I did an E30 Cabrio build (circa 2005, lots of E36/46 M3 parts, big brakes, Nissan SR20DET swap, LSD, etc). I have been an avid enthusiast of the BMW brand and their cars and the passionate enthusiast community for about 2 decades. I also currently own another newer BMW sedan that is a weekend/date night car. 

 

I appreciate your concern for my intent  really

[AceAndrew]

37 minutes ago, RogueFab said:

 

Also, I know these aren't officially an "E10" chassis. That is a common nickname, and we are using it

 

haha, well, you've acknowledged it then.  If you think it'll help get more views, I can't fault the logic.

 

Welcome to the FAQ! Best of luck on your project, looks like you guys are having fun.  Love that you guys aren't pulling any punches.  Looking forward to seeing what engine choice you make and how the car does on track!

 

Please note: We do have a section article style blogs and a section for build threads.  The general area here is purposefully nearly void of build threads, in-part to avoid diluting the section with commercialized content.  You'll find that the many shop owners, fabricators, parts specialists on here all mutually benefit from this arrangement. 

 

 

[RogueFab]

5 minutes ago, AceAndrew said:

haha, well, you've acknowledged it then.  If you think it'll help get more views, I can't fault the logic.

 

Welcome to the FAQ! Best of luck on your project, looks like you guys are having fun.  Love that you guys aren't pulling any punches.  Looking forward to seeing what engine choice you make and how the car does on track!

 

Please note: We do have a section article style blogs and a section for build threads.  The general area here is purposefully nearly void of build threads, in-part to avoid diluting the section with commercialized content.  You'll find that the many shop owners, fabricators, parts specialists on here all mutually benefit from this arrangement. 

 

 

 

Should I be moving this (having a mod move it) or deleting it and re making a new post in a different area? 

 

Also... What do you mean by "pulling any punches"?

[AceAndrew]

Naw, you're fine leaving this here as a new intro thread.  I'd just suggest just putting a link in this thread to your new ongoing one. Seriously happy to see you here though, we could all learn from you and what you guys are doing.

 

Here's the classic build-thread style area, here's the blog section.

 

*EDIT: also, if you want, we have an ongoing "what did I do today" thread where we do all dogpile our progresses, kind of a fun/informal collective way to share progress.  Please post there as well!

 

By pulling no punches, I mean that you're going all out on the car, which is awesome.  It's always fun to see what someone creates without the inhibitions of keeping it "classic".  Really enjoyed the fabrication in ep.2 

 

 

[popovm]

1 hour ago, RogueFab said:

 

Yeah if dumb facial expressions didn't get clicks, I wouldn't make them! 

 

This isn't some kind of pump-and-dump scheme. This is going to be a 1000+ hour car build that I plan to hang on to personally. In my past I did an E30 Cabrio build (circa 2005, lots of E36/46 M3 parts, big brakes, Nissan SR20DET swap, LSD, etc). I have been an avid enthusiast of the BMW brand and their cars and the passionate enthusiast community for about 2 decades. I also currently own another newer BMW sedan that is a weekend/date night car. 

 

I appreciate your concern for my intent  really

 

Heard! Apologies if it felt like I came for you. After being here a few years, I like the vibe of this place and I guess am a little protective.  Glad to have you here and, like AceAndrew, am excited for the lengths you are going to go. I am a relative newcomer to the scene compared to you but I haven't personally seen too many builds that go this far. e46 subframe and arms is a new one to me! Best of luck. 

[02Les]

5 hours ago, RogueFab said:

 

Also, I know these aren't officially an "E10" chassis. That is a common nickname, and we are using it

 

 

Common in Europe & the UK for some unknown reason. Why promote it over here if you know it's wrong?

[visionaut]

Cool. Welcome!

 

Not sure I follow the whole ‘secret/reveal’ approach…

 

Yes, please create a proper blog thread ( new or old style) and provide us a link to it from this intro thread here. Don’t make this topic the build thread.

 

…and please don’t use E10, especially since you already use 2002. Unlike other Bimmers with 02s there’s not multiple chassis to distinguish with the same designation, like say a 325, that requires clarification use of a chassis code to know what car.  2002 says it all. IMO, the only folks using E10 are those that think it’s ‘insider cool’ to talk chassis codes and also aren’t really familiar with 02s. When I see E10 = noob.

[popovm]

@RogueFab, just realized that you are that Rogue Fab. Tube benders and such, right? Your name sounded familiar but I didn’t put 2 and 2 together right away. Does Grind Hard have one of your benders? Or maybe Hoonigan? 
 

 

On 10/28/2023 at 7:33 AM, visionaut said:

Not sure I follow the whole ‘secret/reveal’ approach…

same. The vids go pretty quick so some more detailed discussion via a build thread here would be cool. I’d be interested in details about placement if the e46 suspension components. Using same pickup points? How much of the subframe is retained?

[RogueFab]

I don't want to tag everyone... but it seems relevant. Here goes...

 

 

13 hours ago, popovm said:

@RogueFab, just realized that you are that Rogue Fab. Tube benders and such, right? Your name sounded familiar but I didn’t put 2 and 2 together right away. Does Grind Hard have one of your benders? Or maybe Hoonigan? 
 

 

same. The vids go pretty quick so some more detailed discussion via a build thread here would be cool. I’d be interested in details about placement if the e46 suspension components. Using same pickup points? How much of the subframe is retained?

On your earlier post, I didn't feel attacked. You're good. 

 

Yes, I/we are that Rogue Fab. We needed a REAL race car to install a cage in. We did a little roll bar how-to in another road car we had access to, but we never welded it in because it was someone's daily! This one will be a great instructional platform for tool use as well as a very fun car to build, race, and keep.

 

The E46 suspension was measured and placed using lasers lined up with the OE 2002 (1972 car) shock towers (we established the centers). We did this after checking cross square on the chassis, which was very luckily quite good. This shock tower centerline was dropped down to the frame rail area, and then moved forward the correct amount for a stock E46. We then took that layout, and welded in new shock tops/towers FORWARD .75", and moved the subframe layout forward .75" to match. This kick forward was for firewall clearance since we are running larger tires than OE. We also want the wheelbase a little longer. With 4-5x the stock power level and a suspension system from a car with a wheelbase nearly 10" longer, stretching the car is a good idea. The rear subframe will be moved back more than .75". 

 

On 10/28/2023 at 7:33 AM, visionaut said:

Cool. Welcome!

 

Not sure I follow the whole ‘secret/reveal’ approach…

 

Yes, please create a proper blog thread ( new or old style) and provide us a link to it from this intro thread here. Don’t make this topic the build thread.

 

…and please don’t use E10, especially since you already use 2002. Unlike other Bimmers with 02s there’s not multiple chassis to distinguish with the same designation, like say a 325, that requires clarification use of a chassis code to know what car.  2002 says it all. IMO, the only folks using E10 are those that think it’s ‘insider cool’ to talk chassis codes and also aren’t really familiar with 02s. When I see E10 = noob.

 

Cool. I would like to stop using E10... When we say "Twenty Oh Two" people don't get it. If we say "Two Thousand Two" they think we're talking about an E46. The E10 and 2002tii search terms seem to be the only thing that works, and they're both wrong. Suggestions? 

 

On 10/27/2023 at 3:21 PM, AceAndrew said:

Naw, you're fine leaving this here as a new intro thread.  I'd just suggest just putting a link in this thread to your new ongoing one. Seriously happy to see you here though, we could all learn from you and what you guys are doing.

 

Here's the classic build-thread style area, here's the blog section.

 

*EDIT: also, if you want, we have an ongoing "what did I do today" thread where we do all dogpile our progresses, kind of a fun/informal collective way to share progress.  Please post there as well!

 

By pulling no punches, I mean that you're going all out on the car, which is awesome.  It's always fun to see what someone creates without the inhibitions of keeping it "classic".  Really enjoyed the fabrication in ep.2 

 

 

 

Thanks Andrew. I made a build thread in the new BLOG area.

 

 

 

 

Here is the build blog everyone: 

 

[visionaut]

4 minutes ago, RogueFab said:

Cool. I would like to stop using E10... When we say "Twenty Oh Two" people don't get it. If we say "Two Thousand Two" they think we're talking about an E46. The E10 and 2002tii search terms seem to be the only thing that works, and they're both wrong. Suggestions? 

I’ve never met anyone who says it “Twenty Oh Two”.  Some will say “Two DoubleO Two”. But most all say “Two Thousand Two”. Or just “Oh Two”.
 

To reduce confusion with the year, I’ll always say BMW 2002 (as opposed to a 2002 BMW), or BMW 02 Series, or ‘year’ BMW 2002 (‘72 2002).

 

I’ve also seen it slammed together as BMW2002 by folks trying to outsmart the search. Personally If I want to be extra clear, it’s a Classic BMW 2002 Saloon. 
 

Some will never get it though - I’ve had folks approach me and see the badge on the rear and ask if it’s a year 2002 model! ( but not if it’s an E46). And yes, it’s impossible to totally eliminate the year confusion thing — it’s a badge of frustration us 02ers learn to live with.  
 

IMO if you used ‘72 BMW 2002  Restomod Racer it seems clear enough, and the few folks that found it searching for vids on year 2002 Bimmers will realize pretty quickly…

 

 

 

 

 

[Mike Self]

On 10/28/2023 at 10:33 AM, visionaut said:

please don’t use E10,

A roundie is properly a Type 114; if you want to be really technical, IIRC an E10 is the squarelight shell; the Touring is designated 114K.

 

mike 

['76mintgrün'02]

46 minutes ago, Mike Self said:

IIRC an E10 is the squarelight shell

 

I hope this is not true.

(I will not use it even if it is).

 

[visionaut]

'Tis true, Tom. Even more technically, an E10/73...

 

I don't use the development type Entwicklungscodes - it's a dang 2002.

 

But if we want to get precise, and be way-insider cool, secret-handshake level, we should be talking 4-digit Production Model Codes.

 

Mine's a 2225, brother. 😆