Are input bearings for Getrag 245's unobtainium?

[Rich]

I just had my Getrag 245 totaly rebuilt at Metric Mechanics, you should give them a call, Jim knows his transmissions, good luck

[JerryC]

15 hours ago, Mike Self said:

Once you have identified the bearing type (roller, ball, tapered roller), the ID, OD and width, you should be able to check in a bearing catalog (Fafnir, New Departure, etc etc) and find what you're looking for.  I would be surprised if Getrag or ZF would use a bearing that is unique to their gearbox, and not a standard size, commonly available one.

 

US ball/roller bearings have been made to metric dimensions since the 1930s--I discovered that when searching for a rear wheel bearing for my '59 Renault--seems it was the same bearing for a solid axle 33-36 Chevy...The only one I've never been able to find is for the rear axle on my '48 Fiat.  It's some truly weird sized OD.  But if necessary I can have the rear axle housing machined to accept a commonly available bearing with a slightly larger OD.  Fortunately I have one spare...

 

mike

US ball bearing industry has an interesting history...

Miniature Precision Bearings (MPB) was founded via military edict in the early '30s, when the best ball bearings were manufactured in Germany. As a critical defense component, ball bearing manufacturing needed to be set up in USA to stabilize the source, as Germany didn't seem to be real stable at the time. MPB quickly started importing ball bearings from Germany, while beginning production of their own. Importing continued until 1943 (huh, wasn't there a war going on?). When Hitler found out the factories the Allies were bombing were also selling to the Allies, he put a stop to it. True story, I may have some of the details off, but it really happened.

Now, about the Browning machine guns in Messerschmitt fighters, that's another interesting story...

Jerry

[tech71]

I just bought the other available bearing from the Ebay guy in Latvia and I don't (currently) even have a 245 trans.

If legit, I cant really see a downside to buying it.?

Edited August 27, 2020 by tech71

[rjd2]

On 8/27/2020 at 11:11 AM, Rich said:

I just had my Getrag 245 totaly rebuilt at Metric Mechanics, you should give them a call, Jim knows his transmissions, good luck

can you give me a contact? googling "metric mechanics" comes up with just parts, etc.

[Lorin]

It’s “Metric Mechanic” , no s

[jimk]

On 8/27/2020 at 9:11 AM, Rich said:

I just had my Getrag 245 totaly rebuilt at Metric Mechanics, you should give them a call, Jim knows his transmissions, good luck

+1  I have one also.  Visited the shop when I dropped off the core.  If he rebuilds your trans, there is no core charge.

[AceAndrew]

On 8/26/2020 at 2:38 PM, Son of Marty said:

it's hard to believe they dropped a ball bearing from production worldwide. 

 

On 8/26/2020 at 5:54 PM, Mike Self said:

 I would be surprised if Getrag or ZF would use a bearing that is unique to their gearbox, and not a standard size, commonly available one.

 

On 8/26/2020 at 6:23 PM, jimk said:

+1  Bearings are std nomenclature.  

 

Guys, unless you have specifically sourced the counter-shaft-bearing yourself....... please be aware that this bearing is annoyingly special.

 

After failing to find any from the common sources, I have had several friends and contacts look around.  These include an engineer at Timken, a couple older bearing specialists, a crusty-and-brilliant aircraft mechanic, among others.  The ONLY other place where reference to that bearing type popped up was in the older aviation world, and it had long been replaced by another bearing that required retro-fitting/machining.  

 

As a result, rebuilders inspect the bearing for wear and typically reuse them.  They are pretty durable.... but if worn, I know at least Metric Mechanic has machined parts to fit another bearing.

 

Looked into remaking, but the numbers didn't make sense at the time.

-----------------

 

-Andrew

 

EDIT:  A couple of times in the past several years I've seen them pop up on european-based ebay sources.  Would love to hear if anyone else has had better luck than me, more than happy to be proven wrong on this one. 

[tech71]

 I recall your mentioning this before Andrew, its # 13 right?

Is there an alternate/ mfgr PN aside from the BMW #?

 

Edited August 29, 2020 by tech71

[uai]

the shaft can be ground to make a smaller ID bearing fit -  that's what they did on mine

[tech71]

 I received the input shaft bearing I ordered from the Ebay guy in Latvia.

Yeah, this baby is pretty special ,2 row spherical ball/ roller 

It looks legit, made by FAG in Germany.

Googling the FAG PN 535391 is interesting but not very fruitful for sourcing replacements.

https://www.noc.ua/online-catalog-bearings/itemdescriptionopen.html?bearing=7441615d7c43&title=535391

[Dudeland]

On 9/23/2020 at 4:06 PM, tech71 said:

 I received the input shaft bearing I ordered from the Ebay guy in Latvia.

Yeah, this baby is pretty special ,2 row spherical ball/ roller 

It looks legit, made by FAG in Germany.

Googling the FAG PN 535391 is interesting but not very fruitful for sourcing replacements.

https://www.noc.ua/online-catalog-bearings/itemdescriptionopen.html?bearing=7441615d7c43&title=535391

 

 

Does it look like it will do the trick?. I am getting a bit of pixie dust in the last oil change.  So wondering if rebuilding is a viable option, or maybe time for an adapter plate and a more modern transmission. 

 

[tech71]

I cant really say since I dont have a removed bearing to compare it to. I bought this one out of curiosity, and to put in stock for later possible projects or trades. I dont have a 245, my car is fitted with a 240.

Looks like the Latvia folks have them back in stock. After searching the FAG PN, I suspect this bearing may  still be available from some euro sources.

I did message them and enquire about the unobtainable countershaft bearings, no luck there.

The OP to this thread did say he was buying one from them as well. Maybe he could chime in with a pic or two of old/new bearing?

Unless a source for the countershaft bearings and 2nd gear sets becomes available, its looking pretty dire regarding Getrag 245s. Parts availability outlook on the 240 is also pretty gloomy.

 

Edited September 27, 2020 by tech71

[TobyB]

Yeah, that's it.  Rollers for taking the vertical force, balls for lateral displacement.

 

I suspect if they're showing up, someone found an unopened box somewhere.

 

It's an engineering kluge- trying to get one bearing insert to do 2 jobs while retaining the

precision of both a ball and a flat roller.  

Others went to a tapered roller, with all of the attendant problems they have...

 

fwiw.

 

t

 

[tech71]

 

 

Someone on Ebay is selling 245 components. Cases, shafts some gear sets.

Of course no unobtainium bearings or 2nd gear components.

The few 240s currently on Ebay are all $200 to $300 more than I paid last year. 

Toilet paper panic syndrome?

Think I will go change my transmission oil.

And install a magnetic drain plug..

Edited September 27, 2020 by tech71

[Dudeland]

I suspect that i should start looking up that guy that built an adapter for the rx7 transmission (or was it a miata?)