What do you mean you cant do an alignment

[PaulTWinterton]

1 minute ago, tech71 said:

Steel wheels painted black?

 

Ok, I'll try to keep this on-topic.  @ingramlee  Is it the lip of the wheels that they couldn't fit?  Maybe the new apparatus doesn't have the fittings for the bead.  Heck...I don't see the problem.

My wheels are 70s vintage 13x5.5 Western aluminum wheels.  Minilite knockoff.  Painted with polished lip.

 

 

 

 

[Conserv]

1 hour ago, PaulTWinterton said:

First I've heard.  The two shops I've used had no issues.  Their apparatus look like they'd do 10" wheels.

 

Hmmm...

 

This gorgeous tii would look even better if it just had the right tires! Lemme see.... what’s the right tire for an Inka tii?

 

Kumho? Michelin? ?

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

Edited September 5, 2019 by Conserv

[ingramlee]

5 minutes ago, PaulTWinterton said:

 

Ok, I'll try to keep this on-topic.  @ingramlee  Is it the lip of the wheels that they couldn't fit?  Maybe the new apparatus doesn't have the fittings for the bead.  Heck...I don't see the problem.

My wheels are 70s vintage 13x5.5 Western aluminum wheels.  Minilite knockoff.  Painted with polished lip.

 

 

 

 

Paul,

I'm not sure how and why it didn't fit. All I know is, as I'm looking through the glass into the garage area there are three techs at my car trying to fit the alignment tool on one of the wheels. One of the techs come into the office and get what I assume is the senior mechanic who went into the shop. The senior guy comes back after 5 minutes to tell me they couldn't do the alignment because their unit wouldn't adjust down to 13" wheels. I left and proceeded to another shop 5 miles away. This time before even pulling my car into the shop a guy tried his tool which also didn't fit. The third shop didn't even try it they simply said they couldn't do it.

['76mintgrün'02]

11 minutes ago, Conserv said:

This gorgeous tii would look even better if it just had the right tires! Lemme see.... what’s the right tire for an Inka tii?

 

... I got this !

 

[Buckeye]

Walter, here is place to get alignment 

 

NTB-National Tire & Battery

Address: 5360 Tuttle Crossing Blvd, Dublin, OH 43016, USA

[M3M3]

5 hours ago, ingramlee said:

So I took the car in last week to do an alignment cause the front tires were really worn unevenly on the inside edge and slight steering wheel shimmy. The clerk said I should be out the door in 45 minutes. After finally getting the car on the lift...By the way its the first time the car has been on a lift since my possession in 2012, anyway, after about 5 minutes the tech proceeds to tell me that he cant do the alignment because I have 13" wheels and their machine doesn't go that small.. Crap! now what? So I spent the morning driving around to 3 other shops and everyone said the same thing. For you guys with 13" wheels, who does you alignments. I cant believe cars with 13" wheels aren't being aligned.

inside edge wear on a stock 2002  usually means the front wheels are toe OUT too much.  easy to check with two tape measures.  see the article on doing an alignment that i did.   Ray put a link in his post on first page....or just look in the articles section.  don't bother taking it to a shop.  super simple to do it yourself.  it does not need a shop machine..

 

 

Edited September 5, 2019 by mlytle

[tech71]

20 minutes ago, ingramlee said:

Paul,

I'm not sure how and why it didn't fit. All I know is, as I'm looking through the glass into the garage area there are three techs at my car trying to fit the alignment tool on one of the wheels. One of the techs come into the office and get what I assume is the senior mechanic who went into the shop. The senior guy comes back after 5 minutes to tell me they couldn't do the alignment because their unit wouldn't adjust down to 13" wheels. I left and proceeded to another shop 5 miles away. This time before even pulling my car into the shop a guy tried his tool which also didn't fit. The third shop didn't even try it they simply said they couldn't do it.

These guys probably had the "bubble balancer"equivalent alignment system.

But oh if I only had that lift! Couple of metal plates, bit o grease and Toms sticks? Done.

Edited September 5, 2019 by tech71

[jp5Touring]

46 minutes ago, PaulTWinterton said:

 

Ok, I'll try to keep this on-topic.  @ingramlee  Is it the lip of the wheels that they couldn't fit?  Maybe the new apparatus doesn't have the fittings for the bead.  Heck...I don't see the problem.

My wheels are 70s vintage 13x5.5 Western aluminum wheels.  Minilite knockoff.  Painted with polished lip.

 

 

 

 

 

Off topic, sorry.  I can't believe how well those turned out.

[ingramlee]

17 minutes ago, Buckeye said:

Walter, here is place to get alignment 

 

NTB-National Tire & Battery

Address: 5360 Tuttle Crossing Blvd, Dublin, OH 43016, USA

Buckeye,

How long ago did you have yours done there?This is actually the third place that I took the car. These guys said they couldn't do it before even putting it on the lift. Maybe nobody wants my money. I'm stumped!

[Buckeye]

2 years ago just before BMW Vintage.

Take it back there and show him this post and ask him what he is been smoking

[ingramlee]

5 minutes ago, Buckeye said:

2 years ago just before BMW Vintage.

Take it back there and show him this post and ask him what he is been smoking

I just might do that. The guy that I spoke to in the front office appeared to be very young,maybe 21 years old.  before someone gets upset, I have nothing against young people. I simply mention it because they "usually" don't have as much experience as older folks, especially when it comes to older cars.

[Vicleonardo1]

Dialog: 

Shop #1: 

Mechanic: "Hey Bart! Do you know where the 13 inch wheel adapters are?"

Bart: "Uh No. I think Jesse used them last" 
Mechanic: "Hey Jesse, do you know where the 13 inch wheel adapters are?" 

Jesse: "Uh no. I think Randy used them last. Too bad you fired him last month" 

Mechanic: " Sir, We don't do 13 inch wheels".....

 

Shop #2: Repeat above....

[avoirdupois]

13 hours ago, ingramlee said:

 

 

Paul,

I'm not sure how and why it didn't fit. All I know is, as I'm looking through the glass into the garage area there are three techs at my car trying to fit the alignment tool on one of the wheels. One of the techs come into the office and get what I assume is the senior mechanic who went into the shop. The senior guy comes back after 5 minutes to tell me they couldn't do the alignment because their unit wouldn't adjust down to 13" wheels. I left and proceeded to another shop 5 miles away. This time before even pulling my car into the shop a guy tried his tool which also didn't fit. The third shop didn't even try it they simply said they couldn't do it.

 

Some "techs" or technicians (rather than yeoman mechanics) apparently cannot think for themselves and need a computer to tell them which way to turn a screwdriver.  Even without the latest laser-guided alignment equipment there are basic tools to check alignment specs that most shops should have on hand (even if they are dust collectors).

 

I'm still inclined to think that the shops you visited did not want to get their hands dirty on a 46+ year-old car with which they are unfamiliar.  (I suspect that even some dealers may eschew working on cars they sold decades earlier for the same reasons.)  It may also be that the shops do not have any reliable reference materials - on their computers - let alone any hard copy materials on a "reference" shelf.  This might make a relatively simple task economically impractical.  The fact that your exhaust protrudes from under the center of the rear valance panel, the hood opens in an atypical manner, the vehicle is rear wheel drive and the engine probably does not employ resistor spark plugs  -  may be viewed by "modern" shops as a big yellow caution flag and a fat "uh oh."  Of course, caution works two ways and perhaps visiting a shop unfamiliar with and therefore ill-equipped to evaluate the work you are asking them to perform - is enough for you to say "uh oh."

 

Unfortunately, the last time I visited a shop like that - I ended up paying someone else for the luxury of performing most of the work myself.  If all else fails you can always ask "What would Paul W do?" ?

Edited September 5, 2019 by avoirdupois

[ingramlee]

Its funny that the second shop I visited the owner owns at least (2) very nice 2002's, (soon to be up for sale), and the day I was there they had no fewer than (12) E30's or other old BMW's sitting in the yard and 4-5 more on racks in the shop. I presume these were customers cars. If you're too busy I can accept that. Just tell me so. To their credit they did recommend I try a certain shop on the other side of town. OK I'm done talking about this.

 

Edited September 5, 2019 by ingramlee
added to post

[AustrianVespaGuy]

Toe is actually extremely easy to adjust yourself by eye, and then when you're done double check the amount with the 2x plates or 2x4s and 2x tape measures method to make sure you didn't screw it up.  Here's how to within 1-2% of perfect just by eye:

Drive/roll the car forward on level ground with things as straight as possible to give yourself a good baseline.

Go to a front corner of the car, lie down, and close one eye.

Sight along the outside edge of the tire wall and bring your head inboard until the front and rear tire walls JUST meet; now you're sighting straight down the plane of the tire (obviously a sidewall bulge will affect this, but that's normally not an issue with decent modern tires).

Note where this sight-line falls with relation to the rear tire; ideally you should just barely *NOT* be able to see the rear tire, -> means that front wheel is just slightly toed-in.  If you can just see the outer edge of the rear tire, you basically neutral toe, and if you see just a little bit of it then you have some toe-out.

Unclamp and screw the tierod in/out to adjust if necessary and then go to the other side.

The reason this works so well is because you can see a very fine adjustment in angle over the relatively long wheelbase of the car.  The 2002 wheelbase is just under 100", so an inch of 'difference' at the back wheel means arctan(1/100) = ~0.5 degrees.  A full inch difference in the sight line is extremely easy to see, and I've found I can pretty consistently see/change/confirm about 1/2 inch of difference, meaning 0.25 degrees of toe adjustment per wheel, which is really pretty darn good for a street car.

It costs a 13mm wrench, 10 minutes, and maybe a dirty t-shirt, so give it a try and then check yourself with two tape measures; I think you'll be surprised at how well you can can get it dialed in!

 

NOTE: If you car has adjustable camber though, this one's much more difficult, and I haven't found a great way to check that one in my garage, and resort to machines whenever I want to change camber.