engine and drivetrain Ready To Buy And Need Help With 2002 Options

[Conserv]

And if you think a 2002 feels too rickety, find one of these to test drive, and then get back in a 2002.  this thing makes my 2002 feel almost too NEW!

 

Once again, it's all about perspective..

 

Very nice Econoline!  A '61 F-350 pickup keeps my 2002's "strengths" in perspective!

 

Best,

 

Steve

[eurotrash]

*Falcon deluxe club wagon travel wagon 1964

Thanks!

Edited July 10, 2014 by eurotrash

[ttown]

Well I personally would stay away from both of those cars.  If you want a car that looks amazing I would check into this one:

 

http://denver.craigslist.org/cto/4553994785.html  

 

I don't know the seller or the car (no connection at all) but if it is what it says I would love to have it..  Also it seems like a very good price to me.  It should be a great car to drive also.

[GoFaSSter]

Well I personally would stay away from both of those cars. If you want a car that looks amazing I would check into this one:

http://denver.craigslist.org/cto/4553994785.html

I don't know the seller or the car (no connection at all) but if it is what it says I would love to have it.. Also it seems like a very good price to me. It should be a great car to drive also.

That car is sold to someone on this site already.

[ray_]

(double post deleted)

Edited July 10, 2014 by ray_koke

[ray_]

The red M2 has been bought, tt

 

For the OP, on a/c'd cars don't expect much more than cold knees

 

I'm not sold that the Sahara car has original paint. It's too shiny. Also at 180psi compression I have doubts an M10 can run on pump gas.

 

As has been outlined, go for some rides. There are a lot of 02s in the bay area, and a regional group of them here: http://www.bmw2002faq.com/groups/2-bayarea02/

 

Are you looking specifically at tii's? Why?

 

Don't hurry. Get a PPI and also inspect the car yourself if possible.

 

Good luck!

[Simeon]

The West coast classics ad talks about the car having rack and pinion steering...

[hynrgee]

Great input folks. I really appreciate it. What a great community! I was speculating I may not get any responses. Also, I set myself up for ridicule and you have all been incredibly respectful, understanding and supportive. Thank you! 

 

Mike, I loved your post. Very educational. Knowing that the "jade green" is one of the last US spec tiis. It doesn't mean a whole lot to me by itself except that now I have another factor to research and weigh. It may be as simple as "it's rare" and that matters. I also laughed at your comment about "marrying a girl without ever having dated her". I actually have several friends who married women they had not met until parental arrangements were complete. At last count, and yes we're talking apples and oranges, those marriages were going well. Says a lot about what parents know about their children it seems. That and I suppose something about cultural values. That's for another forum I suppose. Seems there was also consensus about the value of the stock vehicle. That's important to me only because if I get bored with the car and want to move on after some years, it's good to know how to best maintain the value. And EuroTrash, your comment about a fool and his money is about what my brother was telling me. I appreciate your stepping back a bit and providing the wonderful advice you did. Also, can you elaborate on "I already see a couple of things that would have to be replaced...little things that the seller should have the common decency to take care of"? Glemon, in this case I feel the same way about my brother. He has stopped responding to my emails on the matter of 2002s. He's cool otherwise. I also appreciate your (the groups?) perspective on buying the best car one can. I'm there as I really don't want to deal with additional hassles in my life right now. I want a nice toy that I can play with, is reliable, and that I can take up Highway 1 to Mendocino when I want to. It's a spectacular drive and I hope will be even more fun in a 2002. And Conserv, your and Mike's comments about the more than 40 years of technology is another of the things my brother told me, though not as nicely. Any appreciation in vehicle prices is not a consideration for me. If this was a rational investment decision, I would not accept this level of risk. mfbanres and ttown, I saw the ads you referenced several days ago. I was impressed by the red 02 but was even less certain about what it was than all the other 02s. Ray, the reason I'm looking at the tiis is because I got the impression that they have more power. The worst feeling on California roads is merging onto a highway to compete for space with truckers. Your car better have some pep. With two motors, my Prius does. Should I be concerned?  Kamo, I am sorry to hear about your experience. I've been scammed on eBay three times and two of those times I got my money back as a result of the eBay insurance. The third time I discovered that you have roughly two months to file a claim including the time that you should be trying to negotiate a compromise with the other party. Some sellers realize this and game the system so that by the time you file it's too late. Yep, caveat emptor. Hence my presence here. Simeon, are you saying that 02s did not come with rach and pinion?Spike, I left my phone number in an email to you. If you didn't get it, I would be happy to resend.

 

I have to absorb this. Then I have to make a decision to act now or wait. I should mention that I drove a 1976 Datsun B210 for about 15 years until a bad muffler job set the car ablaze on the freeway one day. That was the best car I ever had. It was free. An in-law had no use for it and handed me the keys. I marveled then and now that nothing I did to it prevented it from starting until that miserable fire. The car seemed to maintain itself pretty well too. I didn't invest much of anything on it. One day the liner dropped on my head while I was driving. I stapled that right back into place and was fine for years afterwards. Every now and then I changed the oil and checked the water, but only when I was bored and had nothing else to do. Friends loved piling into the car six or seven at a time, both to tease me for being incredibly miserly as well as to just slum it. Struggling artist syndrome maybe. That car was loud, the air conditioning was the window when it worked, and there were rips in the seats and various dents in the body. I think it led to a few pay raises when my bosses would have occasion to drive with me to lunch, dinner or even meetings. The reason I didn't have a better car had to be because they didn't pay me enough, right? The best day I had with that car was when I parked it with my passenger door about two inches from the drivers door of an inconsiderate person who chose to use two parking spaces. I managed to squeeze into the space and fully expected some form of retaliation for my making it impossible for that person to get into their car through the driver's door. Sure enough I get back to the car after work to a bent antenna and a note attached under the windshield wiper that said, "I would have keyed your car, too, except it's such a piece of shit you probably wouldn't notice." The radio turned on and I listened to some delightful music on the way home with a big smile on my face. That was, by the way, the same car I was on my way to when I spotted the 2002 back in the 90s.

 

So, I will definitely take the collective advice to drive one or more 2002s before buying. Cyclone (Jacques), I love Africa, but it's too bad you don't live next door right now. If anyone happens to live in the Sacramento area and could indulge me, I would be good for at least a beer. I expect to have arrangements completed to test drive both cars this weekend by tomorrow. If anyone can recommend BMW mechanics to perform the inspections in Paso Robles and Santa Monica, that would be great. Does the inspection have to be performed in a shop? or will an experienced BMW mechanic be able to do that on the spot with a minimal set of tools? 

 

Thanks again all and I may follow up with some of you later. I will definitely post what I settle upon. 

Edited July 10, 2014 by Hynrgee

[Stuart]

I did not get your email.  Give it another shot at skjerven4198@yahoo.com.  Check with Rob at the 2002 Haus in SLO for the Paso Robles car.  He might know the car already.  I know of a few guys in SoCal but they are further South.

 

Stuart aka Spike 

[Stuart]

On either the weekend of July 26th or Aug 2nd I will be heading for Grass Valley to pick up my car.  Would be happy to stop by Sacto for a beer after I get her.  Let me know.

 

Stuart

[MikeD]

What is the knob underneath the left side of the dash right under the heater controls?  Also The owner says that it still is wearing its original paint which is Amazongrun but the sticker says Jadegrun. Maybe I mis-read the ad.   I didn't realize  Jadegrun was even offered on the 74tii.  One of the under-the-hood pictures looks like the paint isn't the same on the fenders as in the engine compartment.

[ray_]

I see you have found this is quite a nice community, Mr. Hynrgee. There are a handful of folks who post here (and you'll soon recognize who), whose posts I will read without fail.

 

Tii's did have more power from the factory, however it is easier to mod a carbed 02 for greater power than the stock tii.

 

The TEP rebuild I would look at carefully before a purchase. It is not easy to improve a tii motor/system.

 

That said, I have a '68 1600 (90hp on a good day*), with a 4 speed and 4.10 diff, all stock and I bet I have no problem merging. You may note in the car owner's manual there is a spec, IIRC, for how long you can run the car at red line. These motors are made to be revved.

 

Cheers,

 

*also I have an '02 with 2.5 times that power ;-)

[oblomov]

B210s are great!  (deleted original post)  Good luck searching, take your time.

Edited July 10, 2014 by oblomov

[Andy74tii]

MikeD, I went back and re read the description of the green car and you are right, it is referred to in the ad as both "Dark Green" and Amazon. I looked at the Macartney book, which has a color/year reference, and they indicate Amazon was available 74-75, while Jade was available beginning in 75.

[hynrgee]

With thanks to all of you that helped me to identify some of the questions I should pose, I just want to say that I hope to wrap up the purchase and delivery of the Sahara colored 2002 in the next three weeks. I saw the car at this show (http://www.gofconcours.org/) on Sunday. The seller's 2002 won the grand prize. I drove the car, inspected it on the basis of an internet checklist for 2002s, and got to know the seller enough that I am comfortable that this is not a Texas sale. The car has an impressive history and drives incredibly well even 40 years later. I cannot describe the thrill of not having power steering and really having to "drive" a car. I was back to my Datsun B210 days. Even better I was reminded of the East African Safari Rally and just looked up whether the 2002s even compete these days. To my delight I found this: http://www.eastafricansafarirally.com/info_pages/results.html. I understand that the vehicle I hope to finalize the purchase of can reach 120MPH on a sustained basis. That's academic, of course, as I would never exceed legal speed limits . Nonetheless, I should have no problem merging onto the slow lane of a highway populated by trucks. 

 

While at the "Gathering of Friends Concours" I saw what I believe is the following vehicle. I have contacted the seller to confirm it is the same car. If it is and you can afford it, I can tell you that, based on appearances, it is gorgeous. If it's the same owner, he is a friendly individual that would welcome the test drives that he mentions in the ad. If my purchase had fallen through, this is the car I would be pursuing. 

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-2002-Tii-1973-bmw-2002-tii-super-nice-condition-round-tail-light-small-bumpers-2002-ti-/301244332343?forcerrptr=true&hash=item46238fb937&item=301244332343&pt=US_Cars_Trucks

 

I will follow up with more later once everything is settled. For now, to those of you that recommended that I test drive the car first, I thank you. Even having driven only two 2002s at this point, I can tell you that the test drive was the determining factor in my purchase. The checklists helped and I recommend that non-mechanics use one, but even without the check list, a long period where the engine is on before the test drive helped me to make the determination I needed to.

 

Finally, as to the air conditioning that some suggested is non-existent on any version of the 2002s, I have to say that was not my experience. As the eBay ad indicated, the air conditioning was strong and effective. I made both sellers aware of this post and the seller of the Sahara 02 chuckled. He said he agreed with most of the responses I received, but disagreed with some. With respect to the air conditioning in a 2002 he said that it may be a matter of not consulting the right people. That said, driving with the air conditioning on in San Luis Obispo will differ from driving with the air conditioning on in the central valley of California. If that is in fact ineffectual, I will say so in later posts. I also wonder about the insulation in modern cars relative to the 02. It may not be a matter of the air conditioning so much as the insulation and reinforcement that is challenged by a very open cabin that invites the green house effect. The car may be great in winter but terrible in summer. I will learn that on my own, but the seller did not think it would be an issue.

 

I will not comment further until matters are finally settled.  

 

Thank you again as I cannot adequately explain how helpful all of your responses were.

 

EDIT: Clarification from the seller after reading my update: I should clarify, the award I won at the show (which was a complete and very pleasant surprise), was  from a young car enthusiast who benefits from the children's camp that the fund raiser is for, and who picks a favorite from all the cars that are there each year (and he's a Ferrari enthusiast primarily).

 

p.s. And of course I love my brother and he is generally right about matters of an automotive nature. Any suggestions about how I lovingly tell him he, um, is out of his depth when it comes to 2002s?

Edited July 17, 2014 by Hynrgee