5 speed swap NK

[Naz]

So I was doing some reading up about 5 speed options and it sounds like the only 5 speed that will fit would be the Getrag 245. I think I read something about the 240 being to big to fit in the early NK tunnel. I must admit there isn't much room down there.
 
Having said that I attached some pics of the drive shaft. I was very surprised how light the driveshaft was when I pulled it out. Thought it would be heavy to handle.
 
Any input on what I should be expecting to deal with re: driveshaft once I get a 5 speed in my hands would be appreciated. It doesn't seem to complicated a swap really.
 

 

 

 
 
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[Hans]

You can have the old shaft cut. You need the mark the front and rear sections so they stay in that orientation. It needs to balanced after cut. Assuming the 5 speed has 3 ear flange. If not, find an old 4 ear driveshaft as donor.

[bimbill]

I'm preparing to do this swap on my NK as I get closer to finally putting it back on the road for the first time in 20 years.  Based on your previous posts it appears you have a 2000Tilux that is a transition between the early and late cars.  In that case the body shell is about the same.  However one difference that comes into play for this mod is that you appear to have a two piece driveshaft.  My '65 1800 has a one piece and it is much larger in diameter.  I think it will be easier to deal with shortening/installing your two piece.  When I've done a 5 speed swap in both a 2002 and a 3.0CS I sent the part to Powertrain Industries in So. California.  I'm not sure if that is more difficult to do from Canada as it relates to cost and shipping.  They've been doing these for at least 20 years and they have the equipment to balance a two piece BMW driveshaft.  If I can find one, I'm going to install a two piece driveshaft in my car.  It will require installing the brackets to mount the center support bearing, something you already have on yours.

 

Also a difference that you will have to figure out is the fact that the NKs all appear to have the flex disk (quibo) installed at the rear, attached to the diff input flange.  At the front mine has a steel disk that that attaches to the trans output.  I'm going to try installing a compatible flange and guibo at the front of the new driveshaft.  It's an arrangement used on other period BMWs so not really new ground from an engineering standpoint.

[mich02]

hi NAZ

 

An 245 just fits, i just did that on my nk. I used an e21 drive shaft to match the diff. There is a topic somewere here on this with some more details. I used this drawing that i found here that hold the 245 in place. I made a custom flange to bolt the 4 patern (from the driveshaft) to match the 3 bolt flange from the diff (cant find the pic anymore).

[NickVyse]

My early NK now has a side loader rear end, and with the 245 (which as everyone says, is a tight fit - 240 will certainly not fit in the early small tunnel) I used an e21 prop, which I think was from a 4 speed 4 cylinder car. With this I just had to cut both faces of the sliding joint so it slid 5mm closer/shorter (angle grinder and put it back together on the same splines/no balancing required) and weld in a centre support bearing. 

 

I used a bracket similar to Mikes in Michs post. 4.10:1 final drive works perfectly for me. 

 

[mich02]

I have used the the long neck diff. Here is a topic with some more and a photo of the disc between the rear end of the drive shaft and the long neck diff 

 

 

[Naz]

Thanks for all the input folks. I appreciate everyone taking the time to share their experiences and knowledge. I'm not 100% sold on the idea a 5 speed. I think ill drive with the 4 for a bit and see how I feel down then road.


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[mich02]

4 speed will be fine to on the back roads with an 4.11 diff :). If you're planning long distance trips, i would take a speed. 

 

 

[NickVyse]

naz, main thing is to have the car on the road and making you smile. 5 speed can come later if you feel the need. 

[zinz]

I'm glad to see this thread.  I have a Getrag 245 in the garage and have been thinking I would swap it into the 2000CS during the resto... The CS uses the Getrag 232 (same 4 speed as a 2002), so the mounting points are much different than what is seen in Nick's pictures.  I don't foresee any major complications, to be honest.  I am fortunate that there is a full service driveshaft shop in Austin, so that part of the job is typically easy.

 

Stay tuned... 

 

Ed Z

 

 

[HBChris]

I don't think I would get on the freeway very often in my 2000 if it didn't have the 5 speed, it's a very worthwhile upgrade.

[MOJOJOY]

2 hours ago, HBChris said:

I don't think I would get on the freeway very often in my 2000 if it didn't have the 5 speed, it's a very worthwhile upgrade.

Yes, my old 69' 2000 completely changed with the 5 speed swap, became a great freeway cruiser.

I'm really contemplating doing it to my 64' 1800 as well! 

[Naz]

naz, main thing is to have the car on the road and making you smile. 5 speed can come later if you feel the need. 

Yeah I'd like to start smiling. It will come.


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[zinz]

I'm getting around to this part of the build and we discovered some issues and hope some experts can chime in with some advice.

 

Most all the 5 speed swaps use the 215mm FW, pressure plate, throw out bearing, etc....  Well...my early '67 engine has a 6 bolt, 228mm flywheel and uses the big,3 finger pressure plate. I can't just put a different flywheel on the engine because all the later ones are 8 bolts. The new 215mm throw out bearing isn't nearly wide enough to contact the fingers of the old style pressure plate.  I also can not attach a 215mm pressure plate onto my flywheel.

 

Perhaps I can attach a later 228mm pressure plate?  I don't have one to check if it will match up....internet pics don't look to be the same bolt pattern.

 

Has anyone run across this and have a throw out bearing that will fit in the Getrag 245 lever arm but have a wider contact ring to then contact the fingers of the early pressure plate?

 

Pics below:

 

 

Old throw out bearing on left.  New 215mm on right.

 

 

 

The new 215mm jusssssst barely reaches to touch the fingers of the old 228mm pressure plate

 

 

 

 

Edit...

 

looking around on the web.  The replacement 228mm clutch appears to have the proper mounting holes to attach to my 6 bolt flywheel... can anyone confirm?  if this new pressure plate will bolt up, then it should be smooth sailing to get the 5 speed project rolling.

 

 

Edited June 23, 2018 by zinz

[02tom]

Zinz, you may have already have your answer, but what I see when looking at the 228 pressure plate with the 6 bolt flywheel is that it's not going to work without have the flywheel machined to work.  When installing one bolt on the pressure plate, there are two others that are close, but there's no way it'll work, and the other 3 don't even come close.  I have one other 228 pressure plate that didn't have all the holes drilled in it like the one in the picture, which may be misleading to see all the holes drilled around the perimeter.  Also, I don't have any centering pins on the 6 bolt flywheel, which I think are necessary for the 228mm pressure plate installation; although I may be thinking of an e28 or e24 installation.