engine and drivetrain Kf Fuel Line Routing? Advice Please

[gliding_serpent2]

I very kind forumite (Bill Williams) contacted me to discuss the placement of my KF fuel lines.  I did not do them myself, but after a quick google images search for "2002tii engine" I thought I was in business... (take note of the fuel  line from the fuel filter to the KF, and from the KF to the throttle body)

 

My setup post rebuild (no attempt made for routing accuracy). 

 

BMW's Mobile traditions rebuilt car

 

Bill William's car (god damned gorgeous).  Note that the line from the fuel filter to the KF goes under the intake snorkel, and that the fuel line from the KF to the throttle body goes under the first "loop"

 

 

Old BMW brochure photo

 

Pretty sure this is old official BMW also...

 

Fuel line from filter to KF (thanks Bill). 

 

I have reviewed many images of Tii engines and most have the throttle body fuel lines running "above" the intake manifold, not under the first loop, but some do.    Lots of people also have the fuel line running over the snorkel, but my dad (original owner of my car) said it did run under the snorkel stock.  For the line to the throttle body, he was unsure.   

 

Thoughts on this would be appreciated.  Either way, I am assuming "Bill's" way is correct, and it makes a lot of sense as all lines are snug.  I was just surprised to see how many have it the presumably incorrect "mobile traditions way". 

 

I guess we are all right, just some are more right than others... ;-)

[Conserv]

And as we've found with many other 02 details -- like underhood decals -- there was variability within the production process. Yes, even the Germans were unsystematic at times! Stated differently, some of these questions have more than one correct answer. I don't know if this is one of those questions, but you should at least entertain the thought as you encounter conflicting answers.

Regards,

Steve

[lilmo]

Disregard the MT tii re-creation.

 

I've found the line to the cold start valve is more likely to rub on the underside of the hood if not routed under the #1 runner.  Filter to kfish line under the front filter can snorkel makes for slightly easier filter can removal.  Both depend on the orientation of the fitting on the front of the pump.

 

Perhaps more importantly, it looks like you are missing the hose clamp which clamps the intake bellows to the filter can.

 

I've only seen a couple intake plenums like yours, cast with additional bosses for the 1974 vacuum lines but without the fittings installed.  Late VIN?   

 

Nate 

[jgerock]

Many postings on this funny topic.  It was Bill Williams who pointed out my fuel line wire retainer at the KF pump during my first NCC club meeting (we started at the Wolf Trap parking lot Fall 2007).  I believe Bill said "hey...you have one of those on your car"..

 

 

Picture from the BMW Fuel injection manual

 

Promotional picture

 

Loop-de-loop

 

Hose clamp added by PO to keep it away from the hood at the throttle body.

Edited July 15, 2013 by jgerock

[OriginalOwner]

 I am a bit imprecise on routing, but as long as fuel gets to the cold start valve, and into the KF, then back to the gas tank, ya done good !!

 

 The hose to the cold start valve:  I run it over the top of the intake runner, since routing the hose underneath the runner lets the hose get abraded & it loses wall thickness as it rubs against the runner.  And as lilmo noted, running it over the intake runner lets the hose abrade the paint on the hood.  Can't win.

    Take a look at the picture just above my post:  you can see the little clamp to hold the hose down away from the hood, but you can see the hose touching the first intake runner nut/stud and passing under the runner:  lots of vibration and rubbing there, wearing away at the hose wall thickness in two places.  Just one of those tii "things" you get used to.

 

 and +1 lilmo:  you are missing the hose clamp on the rubber intake bellows into the air can.  You have one on the throttle body, not the big black air can.

 

 and to say it just to say it:  make sure all fuel hose from the outlet of the electric fuel pump to the KF & cold start valve, and back to the tank is rated as high pressure hose.  "normal" fuel hose at an auto parts store is low pressure.  Be sure you've got high pressure.

 

Cheers,

 

Carl

Edited July 16, 2013 by OriginalOwner

[gliding_serpent2]

and +1 lilmo:  you are missing the hose clamp on the rubber intake bellows into the air can.  You have one on the throttle body, not the big black air can.

 

No I am not... because I added the second one three nights ago (old pic).  ;-D

 

That being said, I did an image search on that also and I was surprised to see so many people with only one.  I did not bother asking about this one however as it only made sense to have two clamps.  

[gliding_serpent2]

I've only seen a couple intake plenums like yours, cast with additional bosses for the 1974 vacuum lines but without the fittings installed.  Late VIN?   

 

Nate 

It is a late VIN.  I think the 40th of my car is this month or last. 

[JAS]

I always assumed the notch in the front snorkel was to provide room for the fuel line coming from the filter to the banjo on the kFish. Btw, the banjo can be rotated to make more clearance between the snorkel and the fuel fuel. My tii has a clip attached to the upper far side of the second runner, with the fuel line to the cold start running over the runners, under the clip and then to the cold start valve. Have also seen a number of tiis that run the line under the first two runners, then popping up between the second runner and the throttle body.

[OriginalOwner]

 gliding,

 

 damn .... I was going to sell you one of my original clamps for an exorbitant price .......

 

Cheers,

 

Carl

[BillWilliams]

The clip/strap Jim refers to is what BMW calls a STRAP pn 13 31 1 256 503, some call it the UU clip. That strap/clip is what contains the fuel line from the fuel filter to the banjo bolt on front of the Kugelfischer. The fuel line makes a "loop - de - loop" on it's way there. You can see the UU clip in Jim's photo of the loop - de - loop photo.

 

Some put the loop beside the snorkel, others put it under. Not sure which is correct.

Edited July 17, 2013 by BillWilliams

[gliding_serpent2]

FYI, this is what happened to my freshly painted front snorkel after about 1200 miles of the fuel filter to kf line running ABOVE the snorkel.

[jgerock]

The clip/strap Jim refers to is what BMW calls a STRAP pn 13 31 1 256 503, some call it the UU clip. That strap/clip is what contains the fuel line from the fuel filter to the banjo bolt on front of the Kugelfischer. The fuel line makes a "loop - de - loop" on it's way there. You can see the UU clip in Jim's photo of the loop - de - loop photo.

 

Some put the loop beside the snorkel, others put it under. Not sure which is correct.

Little better picture of the goofy clip

Forgot there was one on my 72tii engine

 

Edited July 18, 2013 by jgerock

[bnam]

A taller clamp above the throttle gives a more smooth curve -- if you care about such things.

 

[gliding_serpent2]

 gliding,

 

 damn .... I was going to sell you one of my original clamps for an exorbitant price .......

 

Cheers,

 

Carl

ha.  NAPA did the trick for me.  Sadly I have sacrificed the concourse value of my car with non-OEM hose clamps. 

 

Don't ask me what a local shop charged me for a guibo and drive shaft centre bearing they replaced (Hint, 200$ and 90$).  Not even OEM.  They got a piece of my mind given I can get non-oem for about 50$ and 30$ from my own sources.  Water under the bridge. 

[BradB]

The clip/strap Jim refers to is what BMW calls a STRAP pn 13 31 1 256 503, some call it the UU clip. That strap/clip is what contains the fuel line from the fuel filter to the banjo bolt on front of the Kugelfischer. The fuel line makes a "loop - de - loop" on it's way there. You can see the UU clip in Jim's photo of the loop - de - loop photo.

 

Some put the loop beside the snorkel, others put it under. Not sure which is correct.

 

Great thread! I am replacing my fuel lines this weekend. Bought OEM hose. Cha Ching$!

 

A couple questions...

 

1. Does anyone know where I could get a STRAP as referenced above? I was at the dealer and the number comes up as a deleted NLA item. 

 

2. My cold start valve fuel nipple points in a different direction than the pictures I see here in this thread. More toward the front of the car rather than to the right toward the manifold. (see my pic) Therefore I can't make the same fuel line routing that you are all doing. The position of the valve, and the way that the wires are strapped appear to be from the factory. (I've had the car over 20 years) Any thoughts? Ever seen this? Can (should) the position be rotated?