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Road going ITB setup


SydneyTii

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I’m thinking of going down this route after many years of contemplation.

i have looked at the Jenvey setups both the ones that look like side drafts and the more conventional ITB’s they do.

ive seen the replica Alpina later inlet manifold paired with Jenvey ITB’s

ive seen a standard kuglefischer pump paired with Jenvey ITB’s.

so please could I get some feedback and pics on anyone’s setup or options.

It will go on a Tii engine euro spec, possibly some very light head work with valve seat cutting?

so cam, spark management, filtration advice will be good.

id like to keep the drive ability of the car, but would like a torquey fun motor if that makes sense.

My brother in law had an A4s which was fabulous, so something along those lines, it does not need to be original A4 induction.

i don’t want to over think this, it could be quite straight forward “ish” probably deluding myself there?

TIA guys.

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ITB's means EFI, start with EFI and work your way out.  How complicated do you want to make it?.  Does the EFI control only fuel or do you want it to control everything including spark?  How do you want the idle control to work? 

 

Budgets get out of control very very fast.  I asked a lot about the Jenvy's which is great for a N/A application, but I am going turbo (longish story).   The challenge with ITB's is the idle, and vacuum signal.   Because there is no common plenum, getting an accurate and reliable vacuum signal is a challenge.  

 

From my research, budgets be dammed, then I would start with a Haltech 2500, if not, a Holley. I currently am running a sniper EFI system, but you will want a standalone Terminator branded product. 
 

I went top(ish) end DIY with a MS3 gold box, which is technically a MS3 product, but it isn't based on the DIY board, but rather it is a proprietary board that uses the same software and processes as a normal  MS3 Megasquirt.  This makes it more robust as it is put together by robots (not by you or me) , and helps to address some of the perceived or actual shortfalls of the DIY Megasquirt 3 board components. 

 

I can't tell you what it is like, because I haven't gotten around to installing it. I am dealing up the supporting systems (brakes, tires, drivetrain, battery relocation, cooling, A/C etc..) , before I go and switch it over to the 3 series EFI intake manifold. 

 

Here is a thread I used to discuss ITB's.  I hope it helps. 

 

 

 

 MS3 Gold box. 

 

https://www.efisource.com/wp/shop/ms3-goldbox-with-8ft-pigtail/

 

 

 

 

 

 

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"Goosed" 1975 BMW 2002

 

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DCOEs are ITBs.

 

IMHO!

 

hee

 

t

 

So the Jenvey Heritage have it double covered then?
 

Actually they could simplify things considerably,

maybe Heritage and a tighter spark control is all I need...

well and a cam and..... oh here we go??

Edited by SydneyTii
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So the Jenvey Heritage have it double covered then[emoji12]
 
Actually they could simplify things considerably,
maybe Heritage and a tighter spark control is all I need...
well and a cam and..... oh here we go[emoji23][emoji849]


The trick for me, and by me I mean a complete noob when it comes to custom efi systems is having enough sensors to detect what is happening.

If it running fine, then everything is sunshine and lollipops. If it isn't then it is time to get out your oscilloscope (ask me how I know).

My next build is going to have a lot of sensors, many would say too many, but when you need them, you really need them. And when you want to diagnose a hole in your in your intercooler or see if a valve is hanging at 4k rpm it will be less of a mystery because pressure sensors and temperature readings will tell you. 10 times the pain in the ass, but better off in the long run.




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Edited by Dudeland
added "sensors"
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"Goosed" 1975 BMW 2002

 

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This is what I get for being too old to read 'build' threads, isn't it?

 

So:  early E21 CIS injection section,  DCOEs as throttle bodies, 

KF pump for the fuel delivery, and a ti air filter?

 

I can't imagine what does the 'tuna can' function...

 

If it was mine, I'd dummy up the DCOE fuel lines- or maybe that's

how the nitrous gets in...

 

heh

 

t

 

kfish and dcoe.jpg

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"I learn best through painful, expensive experience, so I feel like I've gotten my money's worth." MattL

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I too am going EFI/ITBS.  I've done as much research as possible, and have some history with standalone ECUs.  Here is what I was planning on: 

 

  • Jenvey Heritage ITB's (45's)
    • With throttle linkage 
    • I'll reuse my current airbox setup
  • Haltech 550 or 750 with wiring harness 
    • everything else is overkill in my opinion
    • 550 doesn't have self learning fuel trim
  • Radium FST-R fuel surge tank
    • has built in fuel pressure regulator and fuel pump
    • will only have to run one fuel line, no need for return line with the built in FPR
    • Will run one 6an fuel lines
    • Won't have to worry about fuel starvation
  • LS Coils
    • Tried and true, and are cheap to replace
    • Some sort of bracket to mount them somewhere
    • Need a block off plate for the old dizzy
  • Sensors
    • MAP (already built into ECU)
      • The heritage ITB's have a port in each runner for a vacuum lines
      • Will need to run a vacuum box (combines all lines into one box)
    • Water temp (in lower radiator)
    • Air temp (mounted in air box)
    • TPS (already built into the heritage ITBs)
    • Crank trigger wheel and sensor from IE
      • Brand new to the market but tried and true technology
    • Wideband o2 sensor

It won't be cheap $3,500-$4k, but is likely the best/easiest setup available in my opinion.  I also will sell my weber 45 setup to help offset the cost.  

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    • I'll reuse my current airbox setup

Put a Volvo MAF ahead of the airbox.  Tuning consists of all 1.000 in the fuel map cells and drive.

A radiator shop is a good place to take a leak.

 

I have no idea what I'm doing but I know I'm really good at it.

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I too am going EFI/ITBS.  I've done as much research as possible, and have some history with standalone ECUs.  Here is what I was planning on: 
 
  • Jenvey Heritage ITB's (45's)
    • With throttle linkage 
    • I'll reuse my current airbox setup
  • Haltech 550 or 750 with wiring harness 
    • everything else is overkill in my opinion
    • 550 doesn't have self learning fuel trim
  • Radium FST-R fuel surge tank
    • has built in fuel pressure regulator and fuel pump
    • will only have to run one fuel line, no need for return line with the built in FPR
    • Will run one 6an fuel lines
    • Won't have to worry about fuel starvation
  • LS Coils
    • Tried and true, and are cheap to replace
    • Some sort of bracket to mount them somewhere
    • Need a block off plate for the old dizzy
  • Sensors
    • MAP (already built into ECU)
      • The heritage ITB's have a port in each runner for a vacuum lines
      • Will need to run a vacuum box (combines all lines into one box)
    • Water temp (in lower radiator)
    • Air temp (mounted in air box)
    • TPS (already built into the heritage ITBs)
    • Crank trigger wheel and sensor from IE
      • Brand new to the market but tried and true technology
    • Wideband o2 sensor
It won't be cheap $3,500-$4k, but is likely the best/easiest setup available in my opinion.  I also will sell my weber 45 setup to help offset the cost.  

I just received 2 spartan 02 sensors from 14.7. Great reviews and no clunky gauge to deal with.


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"Goosed" 1975 BMW 2002

 

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This is what I get for being too old to read 'build' threads, isn't it?

 

So:  early E21 CIS injection section,  DCOEs as throttle bodies, 

KF pump for the fuel delivery, and a ti air filter?

 

I can't imagine what does the 'tuna can' function...

 

If it was mine, I'd dummy up the DCOE fuel lines- or maybe that's

how the nitrous gets in...

 

heh

 

t

 

kfish and dcoe.jpg

That is a really brilliant design.   A super creative and brave approach.  

"Goosed" 1975 BMW 2002

 

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Here are some pics of my car, work done by North Bay Bavarian in California. Jenvey and AEM.  Car starts and runs trouble free.  Good luck with your project, you won’t be disappointed.

 

Jeff

 

 

20191115_185812_resized.thumb.jpg.a365a560bf804fe63fd93f8cd31cb91a.jpg

How do you like your AEM?  do you work on it, or is it the shop?  I took a close look at one, but support seemed a challenge, at least in Canada/Vancouver area. 

 

 

"Goosed" 1975 BMW 2002

 

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