Advice for this newbie who needs to replace a wheel stud?

[PDX.Duke]

Quick backstory: I bought my '02 last summer and have had some attention paid to it my a mechanic, but with the intention that I would learn how to do, and do, everything I can by myself. I know "some stuff", but am not a practiced wrencher by any stretch. I'm smart and I know how to do my homework and figure as much out before I dig in too deep, but I know next to nothing compared to what I expect is the baseline knowledge of this group. Like I said... a bona-fide noob! 😉

 

OK, so: My 1st project (And, as they say: One thing leads to another!):

 

To address a rotational "click" coming from my left wheel (which, prior to a mechanic having rotated the wheels, came from the right), I diagnosed it as too close a tolerance between the wheel weights and the brake calipers. So, I got equipped with a floor jack and jack stands, got her in the air, removed the tire and had my tire shop rebalance it with the weights positioned more appropriately. I haven't been able to test it out yet because...

 

With the wheel off I noticed what looked like mild wear on the exterior of the left caliper (due to weights rubbing?), I thought I'd pull the right tire to see if it was evident there as well. 3 lug nuts came off fine  but the 4th was resistant. I went slowly but quickly realized that the stud was turning with the nut, and off it came with the lug nut still firmly attached.

 

Looks like I'm going to learn how to replace a wheel stud!

 

Questions:

 

1. Stud type:

I haven't pulled off the hub/rotor assembly yet to see what the other studs look like on the other side, and I suspect this 1st question might get answered when I do, but: Why would the stud have what looks like weld marks (see photo below)? From what I gather, studs are either press-in or screw-in. I haven't come across any reference to "weld-in".

 

What type of stud is recommended, press-in or screw-in?

 

 

2. Removing the caliper:

In all the tutorials I've seen, the calipers are connected to flex line and they just get "hung" there after removal. Mine are connected to hard line. Is this normal for us? And if so, how best to relocate and support caliper while I'm doing the work?

 

 

3. Installing studs:

It appears the critical thing is to get the stud properly "seated", either by using a press (I don't have one) or either a stack of washers or a wheel stud installer (which looks like it functions exactly like a stack of washers?) and an impact wrench (I have that!). Does the stud need to set to a particular torque spec? Or just properly seated to the hub?

 

•••••••••••••••••••

 

I'm sure I'll have more questions, but can't think of them in this moment. For whatever insight and advice comes my way here, I'll be enormously grateful. 🙏🏼

 

Thanks very much,

 

Doug

 

PS. Here she is, patiently waiting for me to "fix" her and get back out there for some twisties.

 

 

[AceAndrew]

1) The welded stud is an non-recommended "improvisation".  It was possibly done to emulate the "bubble" stop found on some wheel studs.  Glad you found this before it sheared.

 Your brakes appear to be larger than original (vented disks).  ASSUMING that you have larger brakes that used the hub from an E21 (you can identify this quickly by seeing if the brake rotor is mounted on top of the hub versus behind the hub), which utilized thread-in wheel studs (12x1.5).  

 

Note that there are some variations to brakes/struts that we'd need to see a picture from the front to fully break down what you have.

2) Hardlines there are normal.  I like to loosen the upper nuts simply because there's more accessibility. 

3) If its a thread in stud, just clean/chase the threads in the hub and thread in a new stud.  Some new studs will feature an allen-key provision on the end to use when installing.  If no provision is there, use the "double nut" method to tighten in a new stud.  A little thread locker is a nice touch.

Edited May 16 by AceAndrew

[Son of Marty]

2002's don't use threaded in studs leads me also to believe you're running 320i hubs as Andrew said easy to check out. When I remove the calipers I leave all the lines and hoses tight and remove the 2 bolts and hang it off the solid brake lines on the car with a wire tie, don't let it hang on the hoses. The ground section on your calipers just might have been ground down on purpose to fit the wheels which is common on the Volvo big brake convention which also uses the 320i hubs. 

Hope this helps.

Marty

[PhilC]

As Ace states that is someone’s go at creating a stud conversion. 02s use wheel studs with a nut. The e21 uses wheel bolts. To be safe you should be using wheel bolts or, if you really want to buy a set of proper stud converters ( this does make putting a wheel on much easier since they are not hubcentric). 
I have just switched to e21 hubs and Volvo calipers and am using the bolts. By the way the Volvo calipers and vented discs are soooooooo much better than the standard 02 brakes so you are on a winner there.

If it were me I would remove all the (likely) dodgy studs and use bolts.

[Mike Self]

On 5/17/2024 at 4:18 PM, PhilC said:

If it were me I would remove all the (likely) dodgy studs and use bolts.

And if you use bolts vs studs, to make installing wheels easier, take a 3" long 12 x 1.5 bolt, cut off the head and cut a screwdriver slot in the cut end, then temporarily screw it into a lug bolt hole, using it to hang the wheel from while you install the other three lug bolts. 

 

mike 

[TobyB]

Furry hamster balls- get those off'n your car.

 

t

lug stud stretchy failures galore.

[PDX.Duke]

@AceAndrew

On 5/16/2024 at 2:24 PM, AceAndrew said:

1) The welded stud is an non-recommended "improvisation".  It was possibly done to emulate the "bubble" stop found on some wheel studs.  Glad you found this before it sheared.

 Your brakes appear to be larger than original (vented disks).  ASSUMING that you have larger brakes that used the hub from an E21 (you can identify this quickly by seeing if the brake rotor is mounted on top of the hub versus behind the hub), which utilized thread-in wheel studs (12x1.5).  

 

Note that there are some variations to brakes/struts that we'd need to see a picture from the front to fully break down what you have.

2) Hardlines there are normal.  I like to loosen the upper nuts simply because there's more accessibility. 

3) If its a thread in stud, just clean/chase the threads in the hub and thread in a new stud.  Some new studs will feature an allen-key provision on the end to use when installing.  If no provision is there, use the "double nut" method to tighten in a new stud.  A little thread locker is a nice touch.

 

Ace,

 

Correct, the brakes are not original. Here are some pics of both the brakes and struts which I hope are clear enough that you might help me determine their provenance:

 

 

 

This next photo is curious to me. The backside of the assembly shows 2 holes where you'd expect to see bolts, but only one of the bolt holes (the upper) is being used - both holes are threaded. The driver side brake assembly id identical. Any idea what's going on here?

 

 

 

Tomorrow I'll have a go at removing the caliper. Hopefully the hard lines will allow me to get them enough out of the way to get in there and see whats going on with the other studs.

 

Thanks!!! 

 

Doug

[PhilC]

My advice to you would be, due to the missing bolt and dodgy studs and not knowing what else is not correct would be to strip the whole lot down and check it all. It doesn’t take long and then you will not risk bending the hard lines. Making new hard lines is more faff than taking it all apart and then bleeding the brakes after putting it back together. That way you will know everything is good to go.

[PDX.Duke]

On 5/16/2024 at 2:43 PM, Son of Marty said:

2002's don't use threaded in studs leads me also to believe you're running 320i hubs as Andrew said easy to check out. When I remove the calipers I leave all the lines and hoses tight and remove the 2 bolts and hang it off the solid brake lines on the car with a wire tie, don't let it hang on the hoses. The ground section on your calipers just might have been ground down on purpose to fit the wheels which is common on the Volvo big brake convention which also uses the 320i hubs. 

Hope this helps.

Marty

 

Marty,

 

See my post right above this and there are better pics of the brakes for y'all to help me identify them (E21, I suspect?).

 

What you say about the ground sections of the calipers being there to accommodate the wheels makes sense. FWIW, I'm running original Alpina 20-spoke 13" x  5.5" wheels at all corners.

 

If I leave all hard lines and hoses tight, will I still be able to move the caliper enough out of the way to have access and get the work done? Also (yeah, I know very little about brake lines as well), if I were to start loosening these line connections I imagine I'd have some brake fluid running/leaking out?

 

Thanks!

[PhilC]

In hindsight, the missing bolt is not missing, if I’m correct you can mount the calipers either side.

[PDX.Duke]

1 minute ago, PhilC said:

My advice to you would be, due to the missing bolt and dodgy studs and not knowing what else is not correct would be to strip the whole lot down and check it all. It doesn’t take long and then you will not risk bending the hard lines. Making new hard lines is more faff than taking it all apart and then bleeding the brakes after putting it back together. That way you will know everything is good to go.

 

Thanks Phil,

 

Yeah, my inclination is to do whats necessary on all 4 corners to get bullet-proof (ie, know for certain that it's all as it should be. When you say "strip the whole lot down", do you mean removing all the brake lines as well with the intention of redoing these too?

[PDX.Duke]

2 minutes ago, PhilC said:

In hindsight, the missing bolt is not missing, if I’m correct you can mount the calipers either side.

 

Oh, wow!!! No kidding? That's slick!!!

[PhilC]

Just disconnect the hard lines where they join the flexi lines. Leave them connected to the caliper.

[PDX.Duke]

On 5/17/2024 at 1:18 PM, PhilC said:

As Ace states that is someone’s go at creating a stud conversion. 02s use wheel studs with a nut. The e21 uses wheel bolts. To be safe you should be using wheel bolts or, if you really want to buy a set of proper stud converters ( this does make putting a wheel on much easier since they are not hubcentric). 
I have just switched to e21 hubs and Volvo calipers and am using the bolts. By the way the Volvo calipers and vented discs are soooooooo much better than the standard 02 brakes so you are on a winner there.

If it were me I would remove all the (likely) dodgy studs and use bolts.

 

Studs sure are more appealing to me, both for ease of wheel removal & install as well as because I just bought a full set of pretty and shiny chrome Alpina lug nuts from Coupe King for my Alpina wheels.

 

You'd recommend bolts over studs? How come?

[PDX.Duke]

3 minutes ago, PhilC said:

Just disconnect the hard lines where they join the flexi lines. Leave them connected to the caliper.

 

👍🏼