Factory Upholstery; Quality & Fit

[Slavs]

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Edited August 9, 2021 by Slavs

[SydneyTii]

Nice,

the factory seats look nicer to me than Recaros, such a shame they aren’t as supportive.

[irdave]

4 hours ago, SydneyTii said:

Nice,

the factory seats look nicer to me than Recaros, such a shame they aren’t as supportive.

 

Stop driving around like Speed Racer?

 

-d

has gone through several different Recaro, Sparco, Scheel Mann seats trying to find something supportive enough to drive like Speed Racer in comfort

[SydneyTii]

15 minutes ago, irdave said:

Stop driving around like Speed Racer?

Lol I wish, just way to many sports injuries to sit in unsupportive seats, that and it’s more like Mario cart, or maybe his grandad ?

[Conserv]

Those are gorgeous, Slavs!

 

The upholsterer I used in Atlanta, John, of the Mad Stitcher, came close to duplicating the  “factory quality and appearance” for both my ‘73’s and my ‘76’s spare front seats.

 

But the restoration of each set far exceeded the cost of a brand new 1967 1600-2, in 1967. ??

 

The goal for both was to see how close I could get to the seats’ original outward appearance.

 

1. The seats were stripped to bare frames and the frames were powder coated: I didn’t want to build beautiful new seats on rusty and rust-prone frames.

 

2. Any seat parts still available from BMW were replaced, e.g., seatback release cables, guides for headrest supports, exterior trim pieces, etc. The two sets of front seats were restored from 2013 to 2016, so availability of replacement parts may be different today.

 

3. The gummihaar pads were replaced with new pads from BMW.

 

4. The recliners on the ‘73 seats — without plastic covers like the ‘76 recliners — were rebuilt and refinished in black splatter paint by Tony at Autobahn Interiors.

 

5. Both sets of seats received new smooth vinyl panels, only where needed. Modern replacements for the smooth vinyl are readily available. 
 

6. The molded vinyl used for the pleated sections, and particularly the heat seams, is the single biggest challenge if you’re seeking a very authentic appearance. Thus, I wanted to restore both sets with 100% original pleated sections. Because the quality of the vinyl in 1973 was higher than the quality of vinyl in 1976, finding the late-1971-through-1973 molded vinyl is quite do-able (first photo). The 1966-through-late-1971 molded vinyl, however, is much more problematic (second photo). It’s older and, today, much rarer in good pliable condition. But, since my project included only 1973 and 1976 seats, the earlier style molded vinyl (1966-1971) was not an issue for me.

 

The starting point for my ‘73 seats included a mint passenger seat — pulled from a ‘72 tii I parted in 1974 and stored in my parents’ basement from that time — and an excellent driver’s seat — converted into an uncomfortable desk chair in the early 1980’s and never used afterward! So I had two seats with near-perfect molded vinyl for the ‘73 seats. And in gauging “near-perfect”, the vinyl’s pliability is critical.

 

The starting point for my ‘76 seats included two very-long-in-the-tooth seats, probably missing most of their gummihaar for decades — broken-down or missing gummihaar is a leading accelerant for seat vinyl deterioration. Without full support, less-pliable 40-year-old vinyl simply cracks. And finding original 1975-76 molded (perforated) vinyl that was still acceptably-pliable was a challenge. One can find “good-looking” molded vinyl, but, without good pliability, my expensive restoration project would fail quickly. Three and a half sets (“set” as in a “pair of seats”) of front seat covers later, we had sufficient molded vinyl to do two seats. And I was only buying the best examples I could find for sale!

 

Still, the original backings on these molded sections, cloth and some padding to define the pleats, were un-restorable. And John felt that the molded sections, now without a backing, were certain to deteriorate quickly. And I desperately wanted the padding that made the original pleats so well-defined. And, again, I wanted original-appearing seats, but I also wanted them to hold up. So… we had to do what we were trying hard to avoid: place a single strand of visible stitching between each pleat on the ‘76 seats. This secured the old molded vinyl to a reinforcing layer, and held the padding for each pleat in place. You would not notice it if I didn’t tell you, but it was the one area in which we could not reach my appearance goal.

 

7. After the seat coverings were re-created and re-installed, John dyed both sets of seats, so that all panels — smooth and molded, old and new — would match perfectly.

 

Original seats, completely restored, are quite comfortable. The ‘76 seats are a bit more comfortable than the ‘73 seats. But given decades of ass-time on 21st-century, all-the-option BMW and Mercedes seats, and decades of age on my own back and bottom, three hours is my absolute maximum comfort time on any ‘02 seat. On many trips between Atlanta and NYC in my modern vehicles, I’ve done fifteen hours — with two short breaks — on modern German seats, and felt no worse than ‘02 seats after three hours.

 

A period Recaro project is in the works, but I have a sense that no ‘02 era seat is going to nearly match a 2020 seat. We’ll see.

 

I rebuilt the ‘73 and ‘76 spare front seats for two reasons:

 

A. I wanted to see how close I could get to original appearance before I restore my ‘73’s and ‘76’s original seats — all in remarkable original condition. The spares were, to some extent, Guinea pigs or test mules, and

 

B. Whether or not that experiment was successful — it was, in fact, successful — front seats are “wear items” and good ones become rarer every day. It is almost too late to do an authentic restoration on those 1966-late-1971 seats, given the scarcity of the early molded vinyl. And I absolutely scrambled to find the very late (1975-76) molded vinyl with sufficient pliability. Mind you, the very best 1975-76 seats are not the ones available for sale!

 

Below, after the photos of the (a.) late-1971-through-1973 and (b.) 1966-to-late-1971 molded vinyls, are photos of my ‘73 (black) and ‘76 (navy blue) seats after their restoration. Lastly is a photo from the 1975-76 U.S. 2002 brochure, showing a brand-new 1975-76 seat. That established my goal!

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

 

[Mike Self]

Slav's problem is the seat color--those "chocolate" seats weren't used after 1967--or possibly very early '68 models and were uncommon even then in salvage yards--much more so than the black, blue, tobacco and saddle colors used on later roundies.  

 

For many years I accumulated rear seats--especially those tall backs for their unworn material.  Even if the top was sun-rotted, there was more than enough undamaged  patterned material to repair two front seat cushions or backs.  And invariably the material I salvaged--and used for repairs--was soft and supple, even after some few years in a junkyard!  The material BMW used on roundies --both upholstery and padding--was far superior to what was used on squarelights.  I suspect it was a cost-cutting move due to the meteoric rise of the mark vs the dollar in the mid-1970s.  The base sticker on my '69 was right at $3k; the '73, $4.1k; by '76 a new '02 started out at nearly $6k--for essentially the same car.  They couldn't cheapen the body or the running gear, so they cut costs on the trim.

 

With the good quality of vinyl dye available today, tobacco or saddle material could be re-dyed to match that early chocolate color.  

 

mike

 

PS--great tutorial on your seat projects, Steve.

[Slavs]

On 6/21/2021 at 7:58 AM, Mike Self said:

Slav's problem is the seat color--those "chocolate" seats weren't used after 1967--or possibly very early '68 models and were uncommon even then in salvage yards--much more so than the black, blue, tobacco and saddle colors used on later roundies.  

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[bmw_e30]

57 minutes ago, Slavs said:

Yes, I had a 68 1600 and a 2002, both in Manilla and with the identical chocolate brown / black interior panels and chocolate brown seats along with the light brown carpet. I still have the interior panels and carpet. I really like the combination which I've seen only on Manilla cars. It's really too bad there is a complete lack of original upholstery materials and padding. The factory pads floating around out there are also very pricey.  And even if using the factory pads, the available vinyl comes short in quality and looks compared to the original. The craftmanship of most upholstery shops I've been to  is lacking. They do a decent job but don't take their time, and it is evident. They even screw up on the flat rear panel on the seat, the easiest piece to upholster. I think it's all about getting the seats done with least amount of effort.

 

slavs i have a guy that only does vintage german car interiors in burbank that did my interior he can likely help you. he probably will want to see the seat and talk to you to set realistic expectations and timelines but he can source the original material from gahh or bmw classic and make it almost "factory correct"

 

tell him ara with the green 71 2002 sent you

 

https://www.yelp.com/biz/burbank-auto-upholstery-north-hollywood

[SydneyTii]

Steve your seats are fabulous!

[dang]

I had a perfect set of black seats for a '73 in storage and a rat decided he needed a 1" piece right in the front.  I wish I'd thought about it like you did.

[Slavs]

On 6/21/2021 at 1:58 PM, dang said:

I had a perfect set of black seats for a '73 in storage and a rat decided he needed a 1" piece right in the front.  I wish I'd thought about it like you did.

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[Slavs]

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[Slavs]

On 6/21/2021 at 12:54 PM, bmw_e30 said:

lavs i have a guy that only does vintage german car interiors in burbank that did my interior he can likely help you. he probably will want to see the seat and talk to you to set realistic expectations and timelines but he can source the original material from gahh or bmw classic and make it almost "factory correct"

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[bmw_e30]

@Slavs here is some pics of my tobacco interior he did about 7 or 8 years ago

 

 

[Slavs]

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