Who’s done 318 Jetronic EFI with MAF conversion?

[jimk]

Yea, I like Haltech for it's features and Haltech periodic improvements/additions as the state of the are in EFI changes/improves at no additional cost.  Like drive by wire throttle, cruise control (I don't use either).  Easy to upgrade, just click the green button, it's all automatic. 

Additionally if you have a problem call up tech support, the tech will ask if you are at your laptop, if so take control of your laptop.  If you are connected to the ECU in the car, he will examine the tune, make changes if ok with you, have your start the car and see if it works.  I've done it.

 

I have gripes too.  Some of the selections for F keys were not setup by anyone who has run the system.  F5 connects/disconnects from the ECU.  F6 starts/stops the datalog.  Hit the F5 by mistake and it disconnects.

 

Haltech does not always include all in the things changed in the description of changes with upgraded software/firmware.  Seems like they don't believe you need to know but sometimes it gets in the way.  It is the reason I had to go to the tech to get a fix.  He unchecked a selection box that I have been using for 7 years and the car started.  The update didn't like it checked.

[Mucci]

40 minutes ago, irdave said:

My feeling is that there is a cost vs. headache/PITA relationship, and I'm thinking it's inversely proportional.

I’m sure there is, but there’s also an income vs. bills relationship that needs to be considered otherwise I’m just relocating the headache.

 

[jimk]

1 hour ago, Mucci said:

I’m sure there is, but there’s also an income vs. bills relationship that needs to be considered otherwise I’m just relocating the headache.

 

Whichever route you select, buy one that you can sell.  I have tried at lest 5 mfr/models and made money on some, lost money on others, but they all sold.

[AustrianVespaGuy]

I'm still going to chime in here with a vote for Microsquirt as the best starting point.  Set it up for either speed-density (MAP based) or Alpha-N (TPS based), and basic single-coil ignition control will get you going for $400 (which includes the wiring harness).  Then once you figure things out a bit you can spice it up a bit; go MAF if you want or wasted-spark or coil-on-plug or whatever.  It's able to do most of whatever you'd want, it then just becomes the question of when and figuring out the plan:

https://www.diyautotune.com/product/microsquirt-engine-management-system-w-8-39-wiring-harness/

Hell, an old AFM in good working order will set you back half of that cost right there, won't it?

And nothing wrong with Haltech if you'd rather go that route, they certainly are a bit more turn-key, but to me $850 seems on the steep side to dive into unless you're already pretty darn sure that's what you want.

[irdave]

1 hour ago, Mucci said:

I’m sure there is, but there’s also an income vs. bills relationship that needs to be considered otherwise I’m just relocating the headache.

 

 

32/36 and call it a day...

[TobyB]

Quote

@TobyB I read that there's some "wall" you hit with the Split Second unit that doesn't allow gains above a 284° cam. That sound familiar or make any sense? I'm not sure the limitation there. 

The Split Second is ONLY a 'smarter' air meter.  It lets you remap the rather linear curve of a MAF into

the slightly different AFM curve, and then lets you make table changes by RPM.

As long as you can get a stable, consistent MAF signal, it can give a stable, consistent output.

 

If someone gave me one, I'd use it in a heartbeat on a 'flapper door' car, but given the cost/benefit

ratio, I don't think I'd base an EFI conversion around it and an ancient L-Jet.

 

t

 

[Mucci]

@AustrianVespaGuy - Ah! I wasn't aware of that MS unit. That's much more my price point. I had only seen the $1-2k setups. I'll look into it.

 

@irdave I don't see how a carburetor would be less of a headache than Jetronic.

[AustrianVespaGuy]

1 hour ago, Mucci said:

Ah! I wasn't aware of that MS unit. That's much more my price point. I had only seen the $1-2k setups. I'll look into it.

Yeah don't go spending $1k on a pre-build MS3 or something, that's WAYYY overkill.  You *could* shave of a little more cost by getting a DIY MS-1 or MS-2 kit, but then you need to solder together the whole board.  That's fun for some people (like me), but understandably undesirable for most, and that 20ish hours of your time only saves you like $100, so I think Microsquirt is the way to go. . . unless building the whole thing sounds fun to you!

2 hours ago, Mucci said:

I don't see how a carburetor would be less of a headache than Jetronic.

Honestly carbs aren't that bad, and I WOULD say they're simpler than Jet, however the fact is *your* setup already has all the Jet hardware, so switching it back to a carb would mean sourcing a manifold and maybe some coolant and vacuum lines, and so I don't think that'd be worth the effort in this particular case.  But don't knock carbs, they really are pretty straightforward and work great!

[jimk]

Here is a trace of a cold start from my car taken about 1 week ago.  Notice the throttle was NEVER touched from cold crank to full warm.  I would say there are lots of EFI installs that have trouble duplicating it.

[AustrianVespaGuy]

3 hours ago, jimk said:

Notice the throttle was NEVER touched from cold crank to full warm.  I would say there are lots of EFI installs that have trouble duplicating it.

Nice warmup Jim! I'll need to do an untouched log of my warmup sometime to see how it compares!

But for the OP or anyone else just dabbling with EFI and not wanting to or having trouble with warmup idle, the super-basic auxiliary air valve from Saabs or VWs work wonderfully.  Just a bimetallic spring that warms up and closes off the 'extra' air.  Just takes +12V, ground, and 1/2" hoses for the air, no programming required!

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/CRB2799

[2002iii]

25 minutes ago, AustrianVespaGuy said:

Nice warmup Jim! I'll need to do an untouched log of my warmup sometime to see how it compares!

But for the OP or anyone else just dabbling with EFI and not wanting to or having trouble with warmup idle, the super-basic auxiliary air valve from Saabs or VWs work wonderfully.  Just a bimetallic spring that warms up and closes off the 'extra' air.  Just takes +12V, ground, and 1/2" hoses for the air, no programming required!

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/CRB2799

That is the same thing used on e21 320i with k jetronic fuel injection. Look

Edited December 30, 2020 by 2002iii
Forgot link

[Mucci]

Any difference between that and the ICV from an E30? Think I have one of those still...

[2002iii]

24 minutes ago, Mucci said:

Any difference between that and the ICV from an E30? Think I have one of those still...

Very different. 

[irdave]

8 hours ago, Mucci said:

 

@irdave I don't see how a carburetor would be less of a headache than Jetronic.

 

Do you not have an engine in your car now?  From this thread, it seems you acquired / received an m10b18 with most of the efi for free.  If you don't have an engine that came with your car, and this is the sole engine you have, then yes, MS and have at it. (Although I'd have to think you can get an AFM for next to free as well- what terrible inventions. Mine came off a couple weeks ago and I have no intention of putting it back on.)

 

But if you've already got an m10 in the engine bay and the car is running...  If finances are tight, set this thing on an old tire in the corner and wait until everything else is going better, would be my thought.  But I've only read this thread, so I don't know if there's other stuff going on.

 

And a carb would be way less headache than trying to adapt a system that you can't access and are just trying to make work from junk yard parts.

[Mucci]

35 minutes ago, irdave said:

 

Do you not have an engine in your car now?  From this thread, it seems you acquired / received an m10b18 with most of the efi for free.  If you don't have an engine that came with your car, and this is the sole engine you have, then yes, MS and have at it. (Although I'd have to think you can get an AFM for next to free as well- what terrible inventions. Mine came off a couple weeks ago and I have no intention of putting it back on.)

 

But if you've already got an m10 in the engine bay and the car is running...  If finances are tight, set this thing on an old tire in the corner and wait until everything else is going better, would be my thought.  But I've only read this thread, so I don't know if there's other stuff going on.

 

And a carb would be way less headache than trying to adapt a system that you can't access and are just trying to make work from junk yard parts.

The car’s currently running with a 32/36 on it. Downside is the motor is leaking from just about every seal so it needs to come out. I’ve rebuilt enough carbs over the last decade to know I’d rather be running EFI, even if it’s a basic system. Sure carbs are great when everything’s working as it should but to keep it in that state requires constant tweaking and maintenance. If I can make tunable EFI happen for $4-500 that’s worth it to me.

Edited December 30, 2020 by Mucci