Bruce, not trying to offend you here. I agree that our chapters are what we make of them, but regardless of that, there are large groups of Bimmer owners who are finding higher levels of commonality and enthusiasm elsewhere. The numbers and demographics support this. I am all for "lighting a candle instead of cursing the darkness" and all that, but at the end of the day 5erfest, V@V, Sharkfest, etc. are growing events while it seems that O'fest becomes smaller and more expensive each year. Inclusion would seem to be the strategic thrust here. BTW, I think it would be a great idea if the Peachtree chapter sponsored a Southeast 02fest. And yes, I would be happy to volunteer. Regards, Tim