other Anyone Bought A Car In Europe And Exported It To The U.s.?

[malagalaga]

I have this vision of picking up a classic car in Europe this fall or late summer, driving it around for a week or so and then shipping it home. The Euro:USD exchange rate is hardly favorable these days, but I'd be doing this more for the experience than an inherent desire to get a good deal. That said, I don't have an enormous budget; thinking I could get away with $7-8,000 total outlay including vehicle purchase, shipping and duties.

 

I was looking at 4-5,000 Euro cars and it looks like I could pick up a clean Italian 1600/1602 without too much difficulty (an Alfa Romeo Giulia is also tempting). I don't mind doing port-to-port shipping; the ports of Houston and Galveston are not too far from me. 

 

Anyway, has anyone done this? If so, can you point to some good resources? Any good tips? How about good classified ad sites in Italy, Greece or Spain? All of those seem to be the cheapest - and driest - places to buy old cars. I know there is a solid selection of vehicles in Holland, but the prices are about double what I'm seeing online in Italy. 

 

Thanks in advance. 

[joysterm]

Sold some parts to a fellow FAQ who happens to live in Greece with a sweet lil '72.  I'd be happy to share his contact info with you, he might be able to help you out.

[Gordon]

In 2004, while working at Ramstein Air Base in Germany. I wanted to bring back a Euro spec car. I found the cars were in two basic categories, restored and out of my price range or total project cars, i.e. bottomless money pits, so I passed. Three months after I returned, I found a 70 Euro spec E3 2800 on the streets of the San Fernando Valley area of LA for $300 that was rust free, imported into CA in the early 70's. If you want to bring back a Euro spec car, look for a car in France, Italy, Spain, i.e. warmer climates where they don't dump salt on the roads in the winter. Cash for clunkers program, road salt, rust and strict TUV road worthiness inspections have taken there toll on cars. In fact, your rarely see old cars on the roads anymore in Germany.  At some of the classic car shows/races that I attended, I saw U.S. spec cars that had been imported back to Germany from the US. Check out the Fiat 124 spider (pic #4 in the below link) that we stumbled on to at the Nurburgring parking lot in 2008 during the Nurburgring Historics. Notice the U.S. spec side marker and license plate lights? Talking to the owner, he said he imported it from Arizona since he couldn't find a Fiat that wasn't rusty in Germany. 

https://plus.google.com/photos/+ImranKhan0/albums/5232658890098016129?banner=pwa

 

The E30 crowd is now into importing E30 touring wagons into the U.S. since the 25 year DOT rule has passed allowing these cars to be imported into the U.S. without DOT modification. The 25 year old rule applies to DOT standards only. If you live in California, you still have to make the car pass CA smog standards and the CA Air Resources Board (CARB) does not like gray market cars in CA, AMHIK. To read more of my story on my experience with CARB when I bought a gray market E12 528i from from out of state and tried to register it in CA, click on this link.
http://www.firstfives.org/carmonth/may2009.html
Any car that is 1975 and older is smog exempt in CA. If you live in CA, you can import and register a 75 model or older with no problems.
http://www.bayarea02.com/features/importing/index.html
I've owned three gray market cars when I lived in CA (E3/E12/E28) and I'll never buy another one from out of state (or another country) again while I live in CA. If had had real deep pockets, then it would be another story.

I would rather have hot pokers in the eye than deal with CARB bureaucracy again. Now that I no longer live in CA, the idea of an E30 touring intrigues me.  Bottom line, do your homework before you import a car.

 

G-Man

Edited February 24, 2014 by Gordon

[malagalaga]

Thanks for the responses. joysterm, is your contact active with any 02/vintage BMW community? Just thinking out loud, but that might be a good starting point for me to slightly reduce the risk of being screwed over. I have enough Mediterranean blood in me to know that the markets with dry, old cars - Spain, Italy and Greece in particular - are rife with con artists. 

 

Gordon, an E30 touring isn't a bad idea, but I think I want something older. The romantic idea of tooling around Italy for a week or so in an old BMW or Alfa Romeo is appealing. I'd like to get something that I could bring home and generally sell for something close to what I have into it. Given that 02s are often cheaper over there, I think I could probably do this. Something like this one:

 

http://www.kijiji.it/annunci/auto/como-annunci-erba/bmw-1602-del-1975/50622587

 

Even though it's a 1602, it looks like something that would be worth at least $7-8,000 in the U.S. I realize this isn't necessarily a money-making proposition, but the experience is appealing. 

[jgerock]

Save some of your money..buy an old car here and have a few glasses of nice wine or beer while thinking you are in Europe.

 

 

And then..spend even more money on the old car here.

[M3M3]

think about what you are doing....would you buy a cheap 2002 in the US, sight unseen, and then expect to drive it around for a week? generally, if they are cheap, there is a reason....they need work. and if on your second day of touring around in europe it breaks....do you know all the parts sources?  shops to work on it?  are you checking a couple hundred pounds of tools and spare parts onto the plane with you?

 

i agree the idea sounds fun...but the practical side of something like this screams.....new bmw european delivery program.....

[M3M3]

Now that I no longer live in CA, the idea of an E30 touring intrigues me. 

 

no need to import from europe...there are a fair amount in us already.  there were two on ebay last week.   one of them sold for a bunch more than you could buy a decent E46 touring for...

[malagalaga]

This is about the experience, not about getting the best deal possible on a beater that can barely limp its way through Europe. A 5,000 or so euro budget appears to be big enough to get a nice car worth exporting to the U.S. 

 

I'm not an impulsive person. I would not buy a car half way across the world that had not been thoroughly vetted by someone knowledgeable ahead of my arrival. And I would not plan such a trip without having a good network in place for repairs and spares. This is where a local vintage BMW group would come in handy as a planning and emergency resource. 

[Conserv]

(an Alfa Romeo Giulia is also tempting)

If you're referring to the '60-'65 101 series Giulia Spiders and Sprints, not to mention the '54-'60 750 series Giuliettas, that boat has sailed! Over the last two years, prices have zoomed upward and you'd be very lucky to find an example that drives for $20,000 here in the U.S.! And by "drive", I simply mean, "able to drive onto a car carrier". $10,000 buys you a rusted out rolling shell -- missing its engine, seats, windshield, and various trim! The Europeans are buying U.S. examples like crazy so I'm thinking they don't have lots of alternatives on the Continent.

My suggestion? First, look and see what you can find in Europe. Second, do not expect anything you purchase in your price range to be remotely safe or dependable as transportation: make other plans for your transportation. Third, recognize that a car that cannot dependably start and drive on its own presents a whole 'nother set of challenges, and costs, when it comes to shipping it home. But who knows, there are always a few bargains out there so practice your Italian!

Good luck,

Steve

Edited February 24, 2014 by Conserv

[Gil. H.]

An Alfa Guy here is Austin has done this a couple of times. He's got the time and cash to research so he's not going low end on price. Even with all the due diligence, things still went wrong.

Here's the link, it'ls a long thread, but worth the read.

Enjoy.

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/aroc-thc-alfa-romeo-owners-club-texas-hill-country/178333-wheres-benjamin.html

[malagalaga]

Thanks guys. I neglected to mention that a good friend of mine lives in Marseille, France, and can be counted on for his mechanical skills and his French and Italian language knowledge in a pinch. That does somewhat encourage me to find a car near Marseille, although France is a bit more expensive.

 

Good advice on assuming the worst. 

 

Regarding an Alfa, I'd lean toward a Giulia sedan - mid '60s to early '70s. Those are plentiful in Italy in particular and seem to be worth quite a bit more in the U.S. 

 

Gilbert, thanks for the link. I remember reading that a few years ago, oddly enough (I used to be an Alfa Spider guy until I got tired of sunburns!). 

 

Anyway, back on point - I really started this thread more to find out good classified ad sources and to see if anyone had advice on legally exporting a vehicle. I'm less concerned about dealing with U.S. customs than I am with getting a car legally out of Italy, for example. For some reason I'm envisioning them saying "no" because I'm missing XXXX document. 

[Conserv]

Regarding an Alfa, I'd lean toward a Giulia sedan - mid '60s to early '70s. Those are plentiful in Italy in particular and seem to be worth quite a bit more in the U.S. 

 

Probably true. But a tiny market here nonetheless.

Sorry if I took the thread a bit off-subject!

Steve

[malagalaga]

Probably true. But a tiny market here nonetheless.

Sorry if I took the thread a bit off-subject!

Steve

 

Ther's no such thing as on-subject on a message forum!

 

Thinking something like this, maybe: http://www.autoscout24.com/Details.aspx?id=239863095&cd=635287068640000000&asrc=st

[mfbanres]

Interesting post.  A couple of years ago Belgium did a sort of 'cash for clunkers' program.  Sadly, they did not discriminate between classics or special interest autos, and real clunkers.  A friend in Bruges dumped his two classic PV 544 Volvos because the taxes were suddenly so high it was not worth keeping them.

 

One of our nephews took advantage of the program to move from a high mileage E46 to a sweet E90, both diesel of course.

 

At any rate, there might be opportunity in Belgium.  (Sidenote, you know what is real popular is Belgium?  WWII-era Jeeps.  Yup.  No accounting for taste.)

 

Cheers,

Michael

[malagalaga]

I thought about Northern and Western Europe since there are a lot of classics there, but the prices are high and the likelihood of rust is much greater. Mediterranean cars are less prone to be rusty. Italy seems to be the best bet for classics - lots of ads for cars purporting to be one-family vehicles that appear unmolested and clean.