roll cages and backseat passengers?

[epicyclic]

Hey peeps,

I've got a new (to me) car on the way that'll be mostly trackday/fun car, but occasional kid hauler. I can easily fit the seat in around the cage, or only put the cage in when I go to the track, but I'd love to leave it in place... I can attach the harnesses to the crossbar, and the kids can wiggle in through the gap, but I want to be safe, of course.

I had always thought that a roll cage would help protect anybody in the backseat, but a local tuner just suggested that an impact with a roll cage could make things worse for the occupants back there. His thought was that the bars may end up protruding into the compartment further than the body would otherwise.

Do you guys have any thoughts about this. I'd love to see some data, though I suspect that backseat passengers with roll cages are *rare.*

Thanks!

[M3M3]

DON'T DO IT!!!!

your local tuner is correct. never put passengers in the back of a car with a roll bar. roll bar/cage tubing is not something you want their head, arms or anything else hitting in an accident.

btw - that pool noodle cage padding you have is useless. too soft to have any effect in an impact. you need the hard SFI rating padding and put it anywhere you and your front seat passenger can reach.

and....i would change your harness attachment point to the horizontal bar on the roll bar. the shorter you can make the straps, the less stretch there will be in an impact.

[Arky2002]

About the only use for a roll cage in a 2002 (my opinion only) is for stiffening the body for racing applications. The roll cage makes it a pain for anyone to get in and out of the rear seat because the diagonal bar creates a lot of interference. I recommend you either not have a roll cage, or not have any rear seat passengers. I would remove the one from one of my cars if the rear seat had not been custom fitted around it.

[M3M3]

just for clarity..

roll BAR - four point attachment entirely behind the front seats. (what this thread is about.)

roll CAGE - six or more point attachment that includes protection for the driver overhead and down the A-pillars. roll CAGE's should never be used in street cars unless the driver wears a helmet and 6 pt harness all the time....

[Hammer03]

Here is what every single person I know and trust has said about this question:

Never ever ever never not in a million years no.

[Arky2002]

good point, thanks

[jrhone]

In my book (and alot of racers books) Roll cages are only safe when using a Helmet. Its not safer on the street. Bodies an body parts tend to move around at impact, and they can hit a roll cage easily and hurt themselves. Its only safer if everyone in the car is harnessed in and wearing Helmets.

[ArdenK]

roll CAGE's should never be used in street cars unless the driver wears a helmet and 6 pt harness all the time....

I wonder what the cops would say if they saw me riding around with my helmet on. I guess there isn't anything they could do about it unless there was something about the car that would cause it to fail the state inspection.

[Harv]

I think in most states it's illegal to drive on public roads with a helmet on.

John

[epicyclic]

Thanks to everybody for the resounding answer. I also posted on my local BMWCCA forum and got the same stuff.

Simple answer: roll *bar* only goes in for track days. I'll also get the right density padding - nice catch.

Thanks for helping me stay safe!!

[c.d.iesel]

roll cages and backseat passengers?

= absolutely NOT!

[Guest]

Bolt in roll bar = for looks only, unless custom built with correct fasteners and large base plates welded to the floor. Even then not recommended.

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/autocrossing-and-roadracing/2455713-pics-of-bad-wreck-at-hallett-10-24-09-not-corvette-but.html

[Otis]

I wonder what the cops would say if they saw me riding around with my helmet on.

It's hard to do, unless you have a sunroof.

[Lee]

On top of what has been previosuly mentionned, may I highlight a few points.

1- The angle of the shoulder belts should + or - 15° with the horizontal plan. Not 60° like seems to be the case in the picture. This is a serious case of spine compression under impact.

2- 4 points belts/harnesses have been outlawed from competition about 20 years ago for a reason. Under impact, the driver submarines under the lap belt, which will rip the driver's internals, leading to internal bleeding in the most minor case, or severing of a few vital organs, leading to blood poisoning. Also, a 4-pnt harness cannot technically be tight as the more you tighten the shoulder belts, the higher on the belly the lapbelt goes. The lapbelt shuld always be positionned over the pelvic bones and never over the soft belly.

3- A rollbar may look cool, but it belongs to special events such as lapping days or racing weekends. If driven on the street, it begs for very carefull use.

[tomorrowcalling]

Actually I've seem it done safely, but not in a 2002. The car in question was a promo day rally car (Impreza) and had a third race seat, with a 6 point harness in the centre back.

The cage was carefully designed to ensure the safety of the rear passenger.

otherwise I agree with everyone else - No