engine and drivetrain What is the general feeling on non-BMW engine conversions?

[gretchen72]

Hi all,

This is my first post and maybe it's controversial?

I have a 1972 2002 touring (Gretchen) which is currently in a state of disassembly. I had her dipped a few years ago to stop the rust, and then she was covered in lanolin and put into storage. Anyway, the project is about to start again and now some large decisions need to be made.

Engine conversion.

Gretchen was in a sad state when I found her. Huge body damage and a different engine block. While the damage can be fixed, the numbers on the block can't be. This was good and bad. While it meant Gretchen could never be restored to a 'matching numbers' concourse level, it did mean that an engine swap was an option.

The dilemma is, which engine?

The options are:

1. BMW M10 that came with the car - full re-build and mildly tuned.

pros - fits, easy, stock

cons - low power, thirsty, expensive, nothing special

2. BMW M10 from a Tii - full re-build and mildly tuned.

pros - fits, BMW period awesomeness

cons - rare (but not impossible to find), expensive, thirsty

3. BMW M42 - partial re-build and mildly tuned.

pros - fuel injected, modern, 5 speed conversion easy

cons - major mods to fit

4. BMW s14 - full re-build.

pros - BMW total awesomeness, killer gearbox

cons - super rare, EXPENSIVE!!, major mods to fit, thirsty

5. NISSAN SR20DET - partial re-build and mildly tuned.

pros - cheap!, 5 speed conversion easy, HUGE power, the engine is the 'right' way around for RHD. i.e. the exhaust is on the passenger side.

cons - not BMW, major mods to fit (same as s14 and m42), not BMW...

So, what's the general thought on the above? You know where I'm headed with this, so, don't hold back.

Adam

[07GTIMYFAST]

I say go for it, It's your car, but what are your goals? fun weekender? race car? If you run a turbo sr20det you are going to need some wiiide rear tires

I imagine it is going to be a lot of wiring but If you get everything sorted correctly a very reliable car.

[gretchen72]

I say go for it, It's your car, but what are your goals? fun weekender? race car? If you run a turbo sr20det you are going to need some wiiide rear tires

I imagine it is going to be a lot of wiring but If you get everything sorted correctly a very reliable car.

Great! 1st reply approves!

The goals are:

reliable, quick, hot.

nothing is set in stone, but a lot of parts have been acquired now, so there are options to go a few different ways.

As for all the ancillary things that need to be done for an SR20, this applies to everything that is not period BMW, so, it's an expected cost and has been budgeted.

Just for background, the touring was never sold in Australia, every one here is a private import. No one seems to know how many are here, but from the research I've done the numbers are less than 10. The touring is a very rare sight around here. I have only ever seen one other in Sydney...

[Simeon]

Do you think it would be OK to swap in this Datsun engine and get a compliance certificate with the Australian Design Rules?

That would definitely need an engineers report so nothing ghetto would fly (no disrespect meant you could well be highly skilled / professional for all I know).

Can't remember all of the details of how the ADR works but there are definitely limits on capacity changes and 'mods' require an engineers certificate unless you can point to it being an option on other 2002s

Maybe Aussies with a better understand can chime in.

A Touring would be very rare in Aus. Nice work

[Stefan_m2002tii]

As others will say it your car and you do what you want with it.

If you can go real M-Power, the S14 is probably the easiest way to go, if you can find one at god price in good shape. Not that many mods to make it fit, stock 02 engine mounts bolt right on. If you want the 265 box some metalwork needs to be done. Not that thirsty outside the track, we got between 7 to 8 litre/100km on a stock S14 in 2002.

Second i choose the M42. This has also been done in many cars so lot of info out here.

Personally i dont like mixing brands, i have have seen some cars with the "wrong" engines on different events and they seem to be out in the cold really fast.

On the other hand, the purists and matching numbers guys turn their back on my car to

/Stefan

[roadhog0]

GO the SR20, cheap, easy, INSANE power. If a Cummins 4bt wasnt so darn tall I would fit one inside my 02....

[gretchen72]

Thanks guys! Excellent feedback!

Re: Compliance.

To be truly legal in NSW Australia any of the mods (including the M10) would have to be engineered. You can blag the M10 engineering, but an insurance company won't touch you if you give full disclosure without and engineering stamp.

As for the the M42 or S14 there is no option but to get an engineer to sign off as the steering has to change to rack & pinion for both, as it does for the SR20.

Re: S14

The M3 was never sold in Oz due to being only LHD and our laws are quite strict about LHD cars, so, e30 M3's are RARE. Everywhere you turn there are e36, 46 & 92 M3's, but no e30. Unless I import an engine, s14 is almost impossible.

Re: M42

This one is the most interesting as far as staying BMW. A full build with a turbo and the M42 could produce SR20 power.

Re: purists

I can understand their POV. That's why Gretchen is more than likely going to end up N Powered. The numbers don't match so it's not a great resto if you want to go concourse, might as well make it what I want then...

Re: GO the SR20

You see, some people will appreciate it!

[Simeon]

Don't think you need rack and pinion for either an S14 or m42

[c.d.iesel]

NISSAN SR20DET -

You know where I'm headed with this, so, don't hold back

yea, yer heading to have fun with the boys and girls

over at the NISSAN (Datsun) message board.

We'll miss you, you rascal you.

[Pamola]

I owned a 91 and 92 SE-R. Even the plane jane SR20 is a great power plant and will give you a 40% bump in output. They are great motors parts are plentiful and are well supported in the aftermarket. I say go for it but do a nice write up for the rest of us.

[schwartzerritter]

Go drive an M42 then think easy mods get close to 200hp and a 1000 lbs less in an 02 put a 410 possi in it and grin.I am told 4 door m42's are cheap.I really want the motor out of old blue in my 16oo Touring. but old blue will about pay for the shipping of the touringto the states.

[schwartzerritter]

You could always put an all aluminum chevy V8 or a blown chevy 4

[NickVyse]

Don't think you need rack and pinion for either an S14 or m42

right hand drive remember - so possible to build a tubular manifold round the steering box and columb, but difficult.

The sr20 however has the exhaust ports on the other side, so will have lots more room and should be able to keep the stock RHD steering box set-up.

[LimeySteve]

My Hybrid Folvo engine is mental too 2.3 Ford block (German Ford ) Volvo twin cam head ( Cosworth ) Turbo etc , 5 speed Ford trans , lots of potential.

[2590402]

I really want to put a single turbo 13b in a 2002. There's something about as high revving turbo motor that I love. Plus it weighs less then a stock m10, so thats two upsides. The only thing I don't like is that it is not a BMW motor.

I have also though about putting a cosworth or turbo Volvo twin cam in an 02. But who knows a balls to the wall m10 is pretty amazing too.