tires and wheels BBS magnesium racing wheels - need help on sizing.

[2002GT3CAR]

Hi everyone,

Im ordering up a set of E50 center BBS magnesium racing wheels for my 2002 and I need some specs to make sure I order these bad boys up correctly.

http://www.bbs-racing-wheels.com/index.htm

My car is racing in SCCA GT3 class so Im restricted to 15x7 wheels. The car has the Schnitzer box flares on it and currently runs 13x7.

As these BBS are BIG $$$$, Im scared about f***ing up on the order specs so I just wanted to double check with forum members before taking the plunge.

My current 13x7s fit perfectly under the Schnitzer flares with 10" wide slicks. The backspacing (measured to the inside edge of the rim - not the wheel bead) is 3.5" front and 3" rear. Those wheels are not hubcentric though.

I am swapping to Tii front struts right now too and going to a E21 late 70s hub vs. my current regular 2002 struts/hubs. Does that make any difference on the front offset? Does anyone know what the hub center bore should be for a late 70s E21 hub (still all standard 2002 on the rear - what hub center size should I use in the back?).

Also, these wheels in 15" are flatbase, meaning that they dont have a drop center and have to be installed by assembling the wheel inside the tire. How big do you think I can size the rotors? I was initially going to do 11.75 all around Willwood setup but maybe I can go even larger with these rims?

Any input would be appreciated. These rims are super pricey so I really want to make sure I get it right.

[Guest Anonymous]

Google "Roger Kraus Racing", they are pretty much "it" for racing wheels/tires here in Northern California. Ask for Roger. He helped me order all new O-Rings , wheel stud kits etc., for my ALPINA 3 Piece racing wheels (which use all BBS parts other than the center). They are also flat rim so it means assembly around the tire - a tricky proposition for anyone that doesn't know how to do it (and few do). You are right, you definitely do not want to screw up your order, BBS stuff is really (really expensive)

[2002GT3CAR]

Thanks Mark!

I just gave Roger a call and you are 100% right. He seems to be the man to talk to for real deal BBS racing rims.

BBS Europe emailed me a rough price quote of 2500 Euros for a set of 4 which is big money for 15x7s IMO. Roger says he can probably knock a little off the retail price. I also priced out a set of 4 Jongbloeds Aeros custom made for $2650 with gold annodized centers. Great wheels too, but honestly I have my heart set on those 100% historically accurate BBS. All the 1970s group 2 pics have the 2002s racing on those BBS, probably because they were one of the only true racing wheels available.

[tjones02]

Thank you both for this info. I forgot that Roger Kraus was a BBS racing wheel dealer... And thank you for the http://www.bbs-racing-wheels.com website.. What great eye candy!

I've been dreaming of a set of those wheels for a very long time. When my funds catch up to my dreams I'll have a set of BBS style E30 wheels.

Not that I don't like the Style E50 bit I do believe that the Style E30 are more period correct for our '02s. I guess it's just a matter of which period though, late 60's or mid to late 70's...

[2002GT3CAR]

I know what you mean. When I first "restored" this 1970s hillclimb car (bought it from a guy named Rick Haner out of CA) I was in my early 20's and just didnt have the means to do the restoration right. I cut some corners unfortunately.

Now 10 years later I am luckily in a different postion financially, so I am doing it right this time. The E50 BBS were used on the 70s group 2 cars and also on the group 5 cars so I think those are the most accurate centers to have for my Schnitzer box flared racer.

I have to repost some pictures of the restoration in progress on the board. The car is getting brand new suspension, billet rear stub axles, dry sump, straight cut gearbox, big brakes, BBS wheels, etc. Should be one of the fastest NA M10 around when its done.

[JK]

I have had my eye on some new E30s for a few years now but the euro is still too inflated for me. One thing to consider about the E50 in 15 inch, like Mark said, they have no drop center at that size. You have to disassemble and reassemble them into the tire. From my experience with the cantilever SCCA GT type tires, they are quite stiff and may make reassembly very difficult to get the rim halves close enough to mate. I'm planning on autocrossing first then FIA class historic so I can have the wide tires and wheels. I'm using the FM or FA slicks which are easier to work with. So 13x10 E30s with no drop center won't be as much of an issue.

Hope that helps. We'd love to see pictures once you get them.

[JK]

The E50 BBS were used on the 70s group 2 cars and also on the group 5 cars so I think those are the most accurate centers to have for my Schnitzer box flared racer.

From everything I can gather....from 1974-1976 The GS Tuning cars and Alpina car (Mark) had 15" E50s. Most of the Schnitzers in 1974-76 still used E30 in 13" and some later in 14". 1973 was pre-box flare and they where all 13"

I just got a PAL DVD from Germany called BMW 02 Amateurrennsport which is really a guys home movies (poor quality super 8 film) of his club racing in 1975...but ALL the club 2002s have Schnitzer box flares, a SOHC M10 motor, a spoiler like mine, and BBS E30 13" wheels....interesting from a historical point of view

The company is VFMC Media and they accept paypal...you have to play it on a computer because it won't work with our video format over here (NTSC)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8406204666675100690

[Guest Anonymous]

You are correct, in 74 Schnitzer was running I think 11x13 and 13x13 wheels on their boxed flared car(s) BBS wheels, GS was actually running 14" BBS wheels - ALPINA were the only ones I think to start using 15" wheels - they knew they could stuff much larger brakes in there and then there were the other obvious like more tire etc., By 75 and definitely by 76 most everyone was running at least 15" wheels. The Schnitzer turbo cars of course ran 16" BBS wheels. The rubber for my wheels is pretty dog gone expensive, and AVON of course is the ONLY manufacturer that makes the right size (pray that they dont stop making what I need).

[JK]

The rubber for my wheels is pretty dog gone expensive, and AVON of course is the ONLY manufacturer that makes the right size (pray that they dont stop making what I need).

With the popularity of Historic racing, they shouldn't. Especially with the future of '70s racecars coming out to play.

[2002GT3CAR]

You are correct, in 74 Schnitzer was running I think 11x13 and 13x13 wheels on their boxed flared car(s) BBS wheels, GS was actually running 14" BBS wheels - ALPINA were the only ones I think to start using 15" wheels - they knew they could stuff much larger brakes in there and then there were the other obvious like more tire etc., By 75 and definitely by 76 most everyone was running at least 15" wheels. The Schnitzer turbo cars of course ran 16" BBS wheels.

From what I have seen in historic 2002 racing pics that is spot on. My class allows either 13x7 or 15x7 wheels but there is a big performance advantage to going with 15" wheels in terms of rotor sizing and tire diameter (a fellow competitor tells me the taller tires on the 15s don't fade like the 21" tires we use on the 13s). Besides, the 15s just fill out the wheel arches better. Both the E30s and E50s would be accurate but I just prefer the more open web pattern of the E50s.

I just heard back from Roger and he tells me that the 15x7s are now only available in drop center, which will limit how large I can go on the rotors. Im going to go with 11.75 Willwoods all around with 6 piston front and 4 piston rear Superlights.

[Rick74]

Just a heads up because you are about to invest a bunch of dough into your wheels and brakes...I am no longer able to use a set of rare 3 pc wheels because my 11.75 inch rotors with Wilwood calipers hit the drop center. With the offset you are going to run the brakes might be on the inward half of the wheel and clear though. Hope it all works out and you don't have to learn the hard way like I did.

[zob2002]

If you want a cheaper alternative, go to www dot htn-felgen dot de

The make replicas and are pretty OK.

Tom

[JK]

If you want a cheaper alternative, go to www dot htn-felgen dot de

The make replicas and are pretty OK.

Tom

I'm not sure they are actually cheaper. I priced the same size at about 2400 Euro a year ago. The BBS are Magnesium centers and are (of course) the real deal. The HTN are machined aluminum and I've seen one case of cracks around lug holes in my internet surfing.