Gauging interest: Scheel Mann to stock slider kits.

[eurotrash]

I have designed and produced two types for myself, because I didn't like how high the adapters for the Scheel sliders placed the seat. So I thought maybe there is a need. I should note that these were modeled off of a square tail seat and slider. I can gather the measurements for comparison to early seats.

1. Folded stainless. Stock slider to Scheel frame. +/- 20 mm lift. You measure, mark and drill. Fasteners included.

2. Mild steel plate. 1/8" thick. CNC laser cut. No redrilling or altering of the plate. Direct bolt on. Fasteners included.

Give me your thoughts.

[NickVyse]

I just made something very similar to No2 for my NK - but I didn't have the plate go right across the bottom of the seat as some of the webbing and padding protruded a little bit lower. I think they need to be this low to work, and suspect that's the same in an 02 chassis.

Just my thoughts..

Nick

[TonyHavana]

I'm very interested in this as I have the exact same project to tackle.

My idea though is to have 2 metal bars per seat, about two inches wide, going crossways. Your number one looks like it might be subject to bending, although I guess that will depend on the gauge of metal.

Number two looks like overkill on size.

Not knocking either one, just my observations.

My question though are all Scheel seats consistent in their bolt holes.

My seats are ASS but have the Scheel logo.

I did a cardboard template, but have yet to get the pieces cut.

But I'm interested in what you come up with. Also I have never seen what the available adapters look like.

[NickVyse]

I'm very interested in this as I have the exact same project to tackle.

My idea though is to have 2 metal bars per seat, about two inches wide, going crossways. Your number one looks like it might be subject to bending, although I guess that will depend on the gauge of metal.

Number two looks like overkill on size.

Not knocking either one, just my observations.

My question though are all Scheel seats consistent in their bolt holes.

My seats are ASS but have the Scheel logo.

I did a cardboard template, but have yet to get the pieces cut.

But I'm interested in what you come up with. Also I have never seen what the available adapters look like.

I have one ASS and one Scheel - outwardly very similar looking, but one has a tilt facility and the other a rotary adjustment for the back. Both have identical mounting holes. I just used 2 flat pieces of metal per seat to extend from the seat mounts to sit on top of the original runners. I used some sheet steel I had knocking about that's probably less than 2mm thick - was concerned it might not be up to the job but it's just fine (and I weigh about 15 stone).

[TonyHavana]

Nick that sounds like what I want to do. I was only a bit concerned with height of seat but difference should be negligible. Do you have the measurements of the hole spacing from one to the other?

Thanks

[eurotrash]

Good observations. And all were mulled over in the design process.

The folded brackets are strong. I drove on those for our Akron gtg a couple weeks ago. Including an auto cross. These indeed allow the natural seat suspension to work as designed.

The plates. Total overkill. But rock solid, with the weight squarely on the mounts. But most importantly, at least for me, the cure for the three inch sag in my seat webbing. The full plate stemmed from a two plate design with the smooth contour cuts for a very finished look, and they ended inside the first rail of the Scheel frame.

This two plate design concerned me for the fact that the weight isn't transferred squarely on the mount, logically seems it would do damage long term, either to the fastener holes in the seat frame, or the mounts on the car.

The best of both is to remove the material in the center of the plate, following the Scheel seat frame, and leaving full lateral support side to side.

Or even just a relief cut in the rear of the plate, in a U shape, following the seat frames, to allow the sheet to flex, providing some supported suspension.

[auggiemize]

Many a mile before I sleep, as to my Scheels restoration...but may be interested in a set of the folded runners for my e9...(just to throw myself another curveball). Probably just be a case of different boring pattern, anyone here know? Ballpark $ yet?

Dave V. in western NC

[JohnS]

I like the plate style mount that you've come up with Jason. Good work. Something in the plate style would work great on an E9, but would have to be wider because the distance between the stock seat rails on an E9 are wider than they are on a 2002. I have Scheels mounted in my E9 using Recaro sliders which I had to re-drill to match the Scheel mounting holes. The main problem on the E9 is the height of the seat. If you think that your Scheels sit high in a 2002, its much worse in an E9. That's why using something like the plate would get your seat to mount as low as possible. I'd be interested in the plate-style mount for a 2002 and also one that would fit an E9 if that could be done. I could create a template for the E9.

Also, does your plate-style mount center the seat on the steering wheel instead of having it centered between the two rails? Thanks,

John

[tinkwithanr]

I like the plate style mount that you've come up with Jason. Good work. Something in the plate style would work great on an E9, but would have to be wider because the distance between the stock seat rails on an E9 are wider than they are on a 2002. I have Scheels mounted in my E9 using Recaro sliders which I had to re-drill to match the Scheel mounting holes. The main problem on the E9 is the height of the seat. If you think that your Scheels sit high in a 2002, its much worse in an E9. That's why using something like the plate would get your seat to mount as low as possible. I'd be interested in the plate-style mount for a 2002 and also one that would fit an E9 if that could be done. I could create a template for the E9.

Also, does your plate-style mount center the seat on the steering wheel instead of having it centered between the two rails? Thanks,

John

@ John - So long as an accurate template was made, it wouldn't be a problem to get the brackets a little wider to fit the E9. They are all cut out through a CNC Laser, So pretty much any custom width/size/shape is possible. It may add a slight lead time and a couple of $ due to the engineering time to draw the cad file, but it shouldn't add much to the overall cost.

As for the centerline of the seat, the mounts that Jason pictured had the seat evenly between the rails. I should be possible to move the holes over to better center the seat with the wheel, but without the seats in front of me I can't say for sure. Hopefully Jason can hop on and give some input on that front.

-Jon

[eurotrash]

I like the plate style mount that you've come up with Jason. Good work. Something in the plate style would work great on an E9, but would have to be wider because the distance between the stock seat rails on an E9 are wider than they are on a 2002. I have Scheels mounted in my E9 using Recaro sliders which I had to re-drill to match the Scheel mounting holes. The main problem on the E9 is the height of the seat. If you think that your Scheels sit high in a 2002, its much worse in an E9. That's why using something like the plate would get your seat to mount as low as possible. I'd be interested in the plate-style mount for a 2002 and also one that would fit an E9 if that could be done. I could create a template for the E9.

Also, does your plate-style mount center the seat on the steering wheel instead of having it centered between the two rails? Thanks,

John

@ John - So long as an accurate template was made, it wouldn't be a problem to get the brackets a little wider to fit the E9. They are all cut out through a CNC Laser, So pretty much any custom width/size/shape is possible. It may add a slight lead time and a couple of $ due to the engineering time to draw the cad file, but it shouldn't add much to the overall cost.

As for the centerline of the seat, the mounts that Jason pictured had the seat evenly between the rails. I should be possible to move the holes over to better center the seat with the wheel, but without the seats in front of me I can't say for sure. Hopefully Jason can hop on and give some input on that front.

-Jon

First, I must state that these are based off of the Model 400 (big bolster) and 401 (low bolster) seats. Incidentally, the frame was exactly proportionate to the Model 320 seats I had before. That being said, we would confirm a couple numbers before taking an order.

Pricing will be figured once we get to the bottom of this.

To speak to the centering of the seat. Its close. Closer than the 320 seats I had before. The issue is that the outer edge of the Scheel vinyl on the seat frame will get cut by the plate to rail fasteners if the seat is not centered. I used button head cap screws to avoid sharp edges near the vinyl. A couple mm either direction will have the vinyl touching or pressing into the fastener.

Once the seats overlap the fastener holes, assembly becomes impossible.

Another issue is that the width of the sliders themselves make attaching the seats to the plate tricky. The inside slider has about 2-3mm clearance for the center fastener heads.

The slider adjuster toothed extension creates an issue on the outside. I drilled an access hole to get to the screw head. This could all be mute, if you simply do not use the inner screws. I chose to.

Below are pictures to show the centerline and how the seats fit in the car when centered on the plate.

(Don't judge me, I still haven't steam cleaned the seats..)

[JohnS]

Good R&D there eurotrash. I think that there might be a little bit more wiggle-room to center the seat on an E9, but I'm not sure.

John

[jrkoupe]

great idea...keep us posted...pricing too!...thnx

btw..nice sneakers..what model are those?...lol

[eurotrash]

great idea...keep us posted...pricing too!...thnx

btw..nice sneakers..what model are those?...lol

Ha! Those are New Balance MR790Br's.. from a few years back. I just retired my leather chucks from car duty due to catastrophic failure, and moved the NBs in to fill the void.

So!

A V1.2 solid plate is in the works. We channeled the rear center with a U shape and will bend it down and brace it, for seat bottom contour. It will be supportive, but not flat. For either the cheap bastard who doesn't want to rebuild the bladders (ME), or the guy who wants to preserve his tight straps, and just let the plate help.

A V2 is coming as well, that has the entire center removed, but the entire perimeter of the frame remains. These may be for those who have nicely rebuilt seat suspension, and want to just let it all hang out, as the designers intended..

As far as pricing, I am awaiting numbers from the CNC guy for a bulk order, and of course a final design.

We are moving fast, so I will keep you posted.

[jrkoupe]

..btw..

found it interesting that one of the seats has a double border seam by the lower bolster,...and the other just a single.....hmmm.

[eurotrash]

..btw..

found it interesting that one of the seats has a double border seam by the lower bolster,...and the other just a single.....hmmm.

Different seats..and wife friendly too!