engine and drivetrain MegaSquirt - Distributorless Ign. / EFI ?'s

[Harv]

John my fear is all those letters you wrote in your post.... EDIS, 12x12 vs. 16x16, MAP Alpha N..... This is what's overwhelming not building the darn thing. I'm quite confident that I can build just about anything - understanding it and getting it to work is completely different!

Read some on msfi.com and you will understand.

The 12X12 just means there are 12 places over the rpm to adjust fuel to air mix and there are 12 places over the map sensor to do adjustmaent. this works out to a sorta 3d grid display (or graph) that is very intuitive to use. Same for 16 X 16 just more places to adjust.

Alpha N means the system doesn't use the map sensor. Insted it uses the throttle position switch and ignition speed to simulate the load reading on the motor. Cars with large duration cams with a lot of overlap need to go this way sometimes since the map readding is not stable enough. This can also be usefull with ITB's. Some of the S14 M3 guys go Alfa N when the cam mods get silly.

Megasquirt is a lot easyer than it looks. Take your time, follow the directions and poof! a running car. My friend isn't so impressed with his Tec3 anymore. I had my car drivable in about 5 min of messing around with it.

John

[wazzu70]

The new version of MS can use Alpha-N tuning (throttle position).

Also EDIS although cheaper is supposedly not the way to go. My friend Matt used MSD HEI coils on his boosted M20 e30. Take a look.

http://www.e30tech.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26128

http://www.e30tech.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26704

MS is a lot easier to use than most people would think. A little reading goes a long way. Also you can play with the software to get the hands on experience before you even install it! The site Harv mentioned is great reading and assistance ect.

The new version of MS has a lot more features making it a much better product. I can only imagine more upgrades in the future....

[PatAllen]

Hi group.

I still realy like my SDS EM4F. It was cheap, nothing to "assemble", the car did run right out of the box, as the guys at SDS initialy pre-tuned the box according to my injector size and engine size. They have very good tech support too.

The wiring was very easy to put into the car.

The newer version of the software allow data logging, tuning is very very easy, plus you dont need a lap top.

Going distributor less is just ice on cake imho. Im sure someone could use a 320i distributor inards (magnetic pick-up) and connect it to its efi of any flavor. Cheaper...plus you have some kind of a waranty on the system, something you dont with MS since its a DIY. If something goes wrong, you have only yourself to go against !!

Pat Allen

[wazzu70]

Any info on cost comparison between units?

[PatAllen]

If i remember correctly, i paid 1200$ CDN for my complete unit, with coil pack, distributor less (SDS EM4F).

all that was needed was my injectors, thortle body+tps, turbo components and fuel pump. Those parts was laying under my working bench...

I used a generic bosh idle vavle, found on most older VW and european car (heated flap valve), later 320i got one as well. Idle is always perfect, not controled by the SDS unit.

picture of the idle valve...

http://www.sdsefi.com

Pat Allen

[winstontj]

Pat,

I'm thinking that there's the way to "get it done" and the way to make things pretty and sexy. I'm thinking I'll go with MS or MSII for my first adventure because of cost and the ability to learn, and for my second motor which will be a more high performance built motor, and possibly forced induction, I will probably go all out with pre-assembled name brand units just because they tend to be more clean and simpler. This way the engine bay will be better looking. Things like Skidmark's crank sensor bracket are expensive, but they fit well and look wonderful. At least they look WAY better than me adapting my own boneyard parts randomly with JB weld and some zip ties.

The only difference seems to be price - and your own competency. If you're good and understand the stuff you can build as good - or maybe better of a system MS wise because you can customize it to exactly what you want. With the others, you just pay someone a sum of $ for what you want... but the non-homegrown stuff has a warranty, brand, manufacturing tolerances, etc. that my own MS system would not carry...

[PatAllen]

Well, you may already know that i am electronic guru, i do engineering of aftermarket things for cars, whatever you can think of.

The logic would say then why i didnt wired my own efi system...which i could have done easely even without the help of the MS files...because i wanted known reliability rather than home made things. I know MS i popular and most say only good things about it...it is still for me the poor's man solution, even the SDS is low ended imho.

You may remember that i was using a FORD EECIV efi system before the SDS, yes theres way to get it done...

btw, i customized my SDS unit. I "straightened" the power supply, the hall efect switch filtering and map sensor filtering...

Im sure someone could achieve very neat loking install with a MS, just a matter of taking the time to do it.

Pat Allen

[Inka]

Just as general motivation, I LOVE my MS2, EDIS setup! I have a freshly rebuilt engine with 9.5:1 CR, 292 cam, port and polished head, etc. Originally I had dual 45mm Webers with a standard mechanical advance distributor and Pertronix. It never really ran as well as I had hoped so I started thinking about EFI. Once I ditched the carbs things got better, but things really started poppin' once I ditched the distributor. The car is SO much fun to drive now. It absolutely halls ass! I dynod the 45s and Pertronix, but I haven't dynoed the EFI setup. The butt dyno, however, says that torque is much better now and I'm guessing power output is comparable. It sounds beautiful at full song too because each ignition event is perfectly timed, etc.

My only advice is to DO IT!

PS I'm running the 318i manifold. I'm sure ITBs would produce more top end power, but I'm afraid to screw with anything right now. It runs THAT good! ;-)

[wazzu70]

Dyno please! Glad to hear you are satisfied. Those are the exact reasons I would want EFI over carbs. It just never runs "right".