engine and drivetrain Loose oil pump chain.

[nikch86]

My engine was making a little ticking noise, so I decided to remove the oil pan to check if it was a rod bearing. After checking all rod bearings for any excessive play, I found out that all of them are good. Then, I started to check if anything else could make noise and found out that the oil pump chain is quite loose. When I push it to the side, it can touch oil pump. Is this normal and could this make that ticking noise?

[PatAllen]

i think you are due to a chain/sproket replacement, otherwise there is some shims available to put under the pump to make the slack less present. You shouldnt be able to move it more than 5mm side to side iirc.

i am debating similar issue with a recent rebuild. did you measured cranshaft for ovality or just checked the berings shells themselves ?

[john_a]

the oil pump chain is quite loose. When I push it to the side, it can touch oil pump. Is this normal and could this make that ticking noise?

First off, you did a very good of describing the problem in a clear & concise manner, along with what steps you've taken to investigate.. then the video is perfect for showing exactly what your words explained!

Too many folks post questions here without details that would make anyone even know what they are talking about, it's refreshing to see someone take the time to communicate.

For your question: Your pump chain is far too loose. BMW says it should just be able to move with "light thumb pressure." Flopping around enough to hit the pump is bad.

Adjusting a new chain is done with shims BMW sells to go between the pump & engine block. These are available in two thicknesses, and are not expensive. Your chain is too loose to simply shim tighter, it needs replacing.

Your oil pump must have been replaced at some time, because it has the single nut sprocket that came on pumps in the 1980's. The chain looks odd, is that a master link? I've never used anything but the OEM IWIS brand chain here, witout a master link.

11 41 1 273 688 Gear new single hole 1 $10.30

11 41 1 716 989 Oil Pump Chain 1 $11.70

11 41 1 250 427 Shim 0.1 mm 1 $0.91

11 41 1 250 428 Shim 0.3 mm 1 $0.91

07 11 9 900 079 Nut - M10x1 1 $1.04

Just wait a bit, and C.D. will surely post the pictures of the pump diagram for the 700th time ..

[nikch86]

This is actually S14 from a 1988 M3. That is why it has this kind if pump.

The block is almost identical.

First. I only checked rod bearings for play without removing them.

It didn't feel any play except for forward and backward which is normal.

About the chain. That is a master link that I suppose should be aligned with a dot on the sprocket, but it is one tooth off. Also is there any way to disconect any of the links of the chain to remove it without removing tha cranck pulley and front cover? Do I have to replace both chain and the sprocket or just chain is fine?

Thanks.

[john_a]

OK, I did not spot the S14.. had 2002 M10 on the brain

The S14 from the E30 M3 has a different size chain, the links are 3/8 x 7/32" compared to the M10 chain's 3/8 x 5/32"

Of course this means the pump sprocket is different than the M10, so the part numbers I listed for the M10 won't work for chain/sprocket. You need the S14 size, which is actually the M30 (old big six cylinder) chain & sprocket. Shims listed are the same, but you should replace the chain, not just shim it. The correct part is available aftermarket from IWIS and comes without a master link (stronger, safer)

The nut is the same, because the actual oil pump (less pickup) IS the same part as an M10.

[nikch86]

What is the easyest way to replace the cahin?

[Guest Anonymous]

This is actually S14 from a 1988 M3. About the chain. That is a master link that I suppose should be aligned with a dot on the sprocket, but it is one tooth off. Also is there any way to disconect any of the links of the chain to remove it without removing tha cranck pulley and front cover? Do I have to replace both chain and the sprocket or just chain is fine?

Thanks.

I am using a PDA that has barely more memory than my 2002's voltage regulator so I can't view the video. But I think I read and understand your post.

If you have a master link, by definition you can disconnect the chain at that link and you would not have to mess with removing the pump or the pump drive gear. I am confused by the markings and being off a link. You are not talking about a timing chain where critical valve timing is involved. I have never heard of synchronizing an oil pump.

Most people will scoff at this, and it is generally not worth the effort, but it is not that difficult to resize a chain with a chain breaker. It was done for years on motorcycles and bicycles and some motor cars. It is a common motorcycle tool. Of course, the difference is that you can at least keep an eye on an exposed chain, if you have any doubts about your abilities or the chain. Unless you are running a custom setup, if you can locate a premade chain designed for this purpose, that is probably the best course.

Using a new chain on an old sprocket is always a conundrum. It would be better to renew both at the same time to insure equal wear. Even if you change the sprocket on the oil pump, you still have the gear on the crank to consider. Removing and replacing the crank gear is a substantial investment in labor.

Depending upon the wear on the teeth of your gearing, it may be that you can get by with a simple chain replacement. This is a judgment call. Because the chain is bathed in oil you can probably get away with just a chain replacement. And even if the chain wears prematurely, with a master link, it is still far easier to replace than the crank gear.

hth

[c.d.iesel]

servicing the oil pump on the S14 is identical

to the M10

sounds like with your description that the chain is abnormally

slack/worn, and suspect sprockets

because you have the pan removed,

and you don't want to revisit there anytime soon,

and you want your Motorsport Motor to sing sweet tunes,

replace the pump, chain, and sprickets.

The history of these parts is unknown.

If the oil pump chain presently has a master link,

you do not need to 'align' it with anything. But the clip for the link

needs to have the open end of the clip FACING AWAY FROM THE DIRECTION OF TRAVEL/ROTATION.

It's prudent to replace the sprockets with the chain

so abnormal wear pattern of old part doesn't cause premature wear of the new.

[Guest Anonymous]

Look at the diaghrams!

Like clockwork!

and appreciated.

[john_a]

What is the easyest way to replace the cahin?

The sprocket for the S14 is available aftermarket (FEBI) for $16, about the same price for the IWIS brand chain.

The wear on the sprocket makes for slack chain, so please replace both (your parts are very worn by how they look on video.)

Skip the crank sprocket (not available aftermarket, very expensive from BMW) but change the other parts.

Removing the pump sprocket gets the chain off, which you should do anyways to take the pump off to install the shims. No shortcut to adjusting the chain correctly, it is not that hard to do it right.

BMAparts.com has this stuff for a good price

[nikch86]

There is a mark on the oil pump sprocket right next to the master link.

That gave me a though that it might need alignment