5speed question

[merek22]

So there's several ways out there to do 5 speed the swap, but I was wondering, what's the response to the various kits?

The main ones I'm talking about are:

Aardvark's kit:

http://www.2002parts.com/html/5speedconversion.html

2002 Haus's kit:

http://www.2002haus.com/kit/index.htm

or Terry Sayther's kit:

http://www.terrysaytherauto.com/TransConv.htm

The advantage for me is Terry Sayther's is in town, reducing the cost by about 300 compared to the other kits, but I want to make sure what I'm paying good money for is top line.

Any feedback?

Thanks,

Merek

[jafcorrea]

Looking for a place near to the Bay Area - SF, how about this one good $$.

http://www.racetep.com/5speed.html

[ClayW]

So there's several ways out there to do 5 speed the swap, but I was wondering, what's the response to the various kits?

The main ones I'm talking about are:

Aardvark's kit:

http://www.2002parts.com/html/5speedconversion.html

2002 Haus's kit:

http://www.2002haus.com/kit/index.htm

or Terry Sayther's kit:

http://www.terrysaytherauto.com/TransConv.htm

The advantage for me is Terry Sayther's is in town, reducing the cost by about 300 compared to the other kits, but I want to make sure what I'm paying good money for is top line.

Any feedback?

Thanks,

Merek

My first 5 speed was done with the help of one of Terry's guys. Talk to Terry and ask him how they do it at the shop. My guess is the old school way of modifying existing parts and such. The plus side is the cheaper price and absolutely first-rate craftsmanship. ANYTHING that Terry's shop produces is absolutely perfect. They really know what they are doing.

That being said, my current 02 has a 2002 Haus kit in it. It's fantastic. The only issue with this kit is that Rob at 2002 Haus prefers to install them in his shop....which is in California. First rate kit, though. REALLY nice craftsmanship.

No idea about the kit from Aardvarc, though....but Dave's a really nice guy.

Good luck.

[merek22]

Thanks! Sounds like I will probably go with Terry's once I can make a few bucks.

-Merek

[thehackmechanic]

I lived in Austin for a few years in the 80s and am in Terry's debt for all of his assistance help during that time. Terry's a great guy, but you already know that. And going with someone local has enormous value when you have questions or need ancillary parts. If you have any doubt, I'd recommend erring on that side.

That having been said, Dave at Aardvark is also one of the nicest guys you'll ever swap stories with, and Dave helped me out with a driveshaft problem I had during my last 5-speed installation.

The main challenge for the DIYer doing a 5-speed installation is dealing with the necessary relocation of the transmission support bracket. This is a total pain in the butt, whereas the rest of the installation is basic nuts-and-bolts. I'm sure you're already aware that a 2002's transmission is secured at the back by a straight-across bracket that supports the weight of the transmission (it holds it up via the rubber bushing), and is attached to two mounting tabs welded to the underside of the tunnel. Since the 5-speed OD trani is about 3.5" longer (3.5625") than the stock 4-speed, in addition to having to shorten the driveshaft, the shifter, and the shift platform, the method by which the back of the trani is supported needs to be moved rearward as well. There are two basic ways to do this:

1) Physically move the mounting points further back (ie use a straight-across bracket but attach it to the underside of the tunnel 3.5" further back), or

2) Leave the mounting points where they are and utilize an adapter of some kind that adapts the stock mounting points to the transmission bushing, which, again, is now about 3.5" further back than it was.

The kit that Dave / Aardvark sells, I believe, comes with mounting tabs that look just like the ones welded to the underside of the tunnel. There is someone on the parts page of this site selling the tabs and a bracket of the right length. I believe the OEM mounting tabs are even still available (http://www.bimmers.com/02/upgrades/transmission.html has a good explanation of the whole 5-speed conversion process, including the part numbers for the mounting tabs). You then can very carefully mount -- either by welding or by bolting, or both -- these tabs 3.5625" further back, and at the same height, as the old ones. Personally, I found this to be a difficult, time-consuming process, requiring you to drill holes, which as Mike Miller says, is like injecting cancer into a patient. Another thing to note that isn't often written about is that, since the transmission tunnel narrows toward the back of the car, when you've relocated the mounting tabs, the stock cross-piece won't fit -- it's too long, due to the narrowing of the tunnel. You need to shorten it.

The crossmember / mount sold by Top End Performance (racetep.com) combines the cross-piece and the tabs into one structure, but it also requires drilling holes in the tunnel.

The other way to do it is to use a mount that attaches to the stock mounting tabs. One can argue whether cantilevering the weight of the transmission in this way introduces undesirable stresses, but let's leave that aside for the moment. If you look carefully at the photos on the 2002haus web site, you'll see that they use a very simple, elegant, U-shaped mount that bolts to the underside of the stock tabs on the tunnel. I don't believe that they sell this piece a la carte. If you search on the parts page of this site, you'll see that someone was selling a similar piece.

Jim Rowe at Metric Mechanic sells a more elaborate bracket for about $300 that also utilizes the stock mounting location. I used one of these 20 years ago and, like most things from Metric, it was well-engineered and fit absolutely perfectly.

Since Terry's 5-speed page is generic for a bunch of models (not just 2002s), I can't tell which kind of mount he uses -- one that uses the existing tabs or one that requires relocation.

There are many other pieces to these kits -- shift platform, shifter, etc. The 2002Haus stuff looks absolutely gorgeous. If you have a hard-on for gorgeous stuff under your car, who am I to try and talk you out of it? Me, none of my cars are pristine, and I would feel remiss spending a dime extra for beautiful hardware that I'd bolt up to a grimy undercarriage.

--Rob

[merek22]

Thanks Rob, wow, that was a lot, but I'll keep all of that in mind.

Once I find the money, I will talk to Terry, and see what the kit is really compiled of. Thanks again though.

-Merek