relay?

[Guarionex]

Is this a relay? There are two wires (red & black)connecting to this that are coming from the starter. The car wont start but if I take the black wire out from the starter and connect a wire from the starter to the battery, the car starts fine. So I am thinking that something is wrong with this part (relay?) I took the part # and have tried different places but apparently it is wrong. It is a Bosch part 0332003014. Any idea where I can find this thing? Car is 1970 2002.

thanks

[HBChris]

Yes, it is a relay that bypasses the ballast resistor next to your coil during cranking. Here is another pic.

[Guarionex]

thanks, any idea where In can get a new one? And how I should ask for, what type of relay<

thanks

[Guarionex]

BTW, your engine bay looks incredible.

[Guest Anonymous]

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See item #3 in the schematic.

The relay is energized when the starter is cranking. The relay's switch closes and supplies full battery voltage to the ignition coil. After the engine starts, the relay opens and the ignition is supplied voltage through the resistor - item #2 in the schematic.

This is a simple relay. A good parts person should be able to sell you a relay that will do the job even if its not Bosch.

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[hrg88]

Or just throw the relay out and use the output of the starter solenoid like is done on the later cars.

[HBChris]

The relay serves a purpose unless there is no ballast resistor and you have the blue coil. Look under the relay, each terminal should have a number, from that you should be able to find another relay with the same terminal configuration. Have you checked RealOEM to see if it is available?

[Guarionex]

Thanks you all for the responses. So, can I eliminate the resistor, condenser and points and replace it whit a Pertronic system and a blue coil? Would that do the trick. This is going to be my daily driver, I am not restoring the car as original, I just want to keep it running. It will take a lot of effort and $$ to get this one in excellent shape.

thanks again.

BTW, I looked at Realoem.com and the part is discontinued. In any case I will see if I can get a replacement, if the set-up mentioned above those not work.

saludos

Oswaldo

[ingraham]

You almost certainly have a wiring problem. It's easier to fix the wiring problem than it is to redesign the existing setup and then fix the problem anyway. Pertronix is a good thing, but you should definitely sort out this problem before installing it.

I think you are saying the engine does not crank over with the key, but it does crank over when you connect +12 volts directly to terminal 50 on the starter solenoid. Correct? Did the car ever start correctly? What work was done between then and now? Does the engine fire and run after you crank it with the jumper wire?

The relay does not control the starter, so the relay is not your problem.

Does your starter solenoid have two small terminals numbered 15 and 50? There should be one or two black wires to terminal 50. If you have a termial 15, is there any external wire connected to it?

It looks like you have a blue coil. If so, you don't need the ballast resistor and bypass relay. But they do little harm for now. First get the starter working, then you can eliminate them.

[Guarionex]

thanks a lot for taking your time to advise. I just bought the car and PO told me that was starting before. He was working around the switch area and I found a black wire close to the ignition switch that was hanging around. So I thought that that wire was the problem, i re-connected and connected the other end to the solenoid, no crank, so I by pass the black wire by disconnected from the solenoid and put a wire from there to the ignition switch then the car started. The solenoid has two wire coming out one black (the one with the problem) and one red that goes to +. I followed these wires and there are both going to the relay. So, I thought that was the relay because it will start when I by passed.

[ingraham]

Is this car is a US model? What is the VIN? Month/year of manufacture? Do you have a six-fuse or twelve-fuse box? Automatic transmission? I ask because the wiring diagrams I've looked at show the ballast bypass relay starting with 1971 models.

Your ignition switch should have the following wires attached, assuming a US model with 12-fuse box, but YMMV:

Terminal P - small GREY wire to headlight switch

Terminal R - small VIOLET wire to fusebox

Terminal 15 - big GREEN wire to fusebox

Terminal 15 - medium GREEN wire to light switch

Terminal 15 - small GREEN wire to headlight dip switch (left side)

Terminal 50 - medium BLACK wire to starter motor terminal 50

Terminal 30 - large RED wire from battery

Terminal 30 - medium RED wire to light switch

Your ballast bypass relay should have the following wires attached, same assumptions:

Terminal 30 - medium GREEN wire from fusebox

Terminal 30 - medium GREEN wire to ballast resistor

Terminal 85 - small BROWN wire to chassis ground

Terminal 86 - small BLACK wire from starter motor terminal 50

Terminal 87 - medium GREEN/RED wire to ignition coil terminal 15

There should be an additional GREEN/RED wire from ignition coil terminal 15 to the other end of the ballast resistor.

[Guarionex]

Thanks a lot for the info. The car is 1970 US model 4 speed vin number is 1670965 and it is 6 fuses box. Dont know month of manufacture.

thanks again

[sprout1600itb]

Reviving a very old topic. Couple of quick follow up questions: 1) is that relay necessary? 2) if not what is the starter solenoid actually connected to? In my car the red and black wires (the only other wires connect to the starter besides the battery) are connected to this relay. There was one post in here that said "just eliminate it". Not sure that it would actually work. My issue is that I am eliminating the coil and going with a completely electornic ignition system as a part of a MegaSquirt set up. Any help would be greatly apprecaited. Right now, i am just eliminated the coil and the ballast from the loop. Thanks in advance.

Edited September 21, 2015 by sprout1600itb

[Artcop]

Shout out to Ingraham and hbchris for the deets. Yuge help. Smiley faces your way..

[HBChris]

As stated earlier, the relay only bypasses the ballast resistor to apply full current to the ignition system, otherwise it is resisted so you don't wear out points prematurely.  And with a blue coil it isn't needed, it would be redundant.  With Megasquirt it is totally useless.  And with the lightweight starters it is also not needed as the car starts so much quicker.  Be sure the ignition switch wires are all intact.