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Einspritz last won the day on May 7

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    2002 Tii, 2002 Turbo

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  1. OK. I don't know how, but can we move this to a new thread?
  2. Today's Orange parts book discoveries find a few things: As Steve noted, plastic runners for Euro engines went up from VIN 2710776 (LHD) and 2750863 (RHD) with USA models from 2761944 to 2762014 respectively. Only 70 USA units? Hmmmm. If so, then ya gots a rarity. Metal runners on Euro models up to 2710776 (LHD) and 2750863 (RHD) with USA models from 2761944 to 2762014 and a further change at 2762372 which I believe corresponds to a plenum part number change, perhaps due to the later smog equipped engines. Some have additional vacuum ports, IIRC. The pump succession is interesting. Euro pumps in the parts book do not have a VIN correlation, but their are three successions, from 13 51 259 882 to 13 51 0 739 877 to 13 51 1 259 887 prior to then correlating with the USA models with a succession from 13 51 1 256 537 to 13 51 0 739 875 to 13 51 1 256 536. Note that the USA Modell 74 also had the 13 51 1 259 535 pump exclusively. So, the early Euro pumps had something different from the USA pumps. So, the next question is what is the difference between those pump numbers? Internal cam? Warm up regulator? Linkages? Heads and pistons: From Mike Macartney's book, states that the 121 and 121Ti heads were were used up to September 1972 being superseded by the E12 head onward, and the raised bathtub pistons were used on the early 121 variants with compression ratios between 9:1 and 10:1, while late variants of the Tii with the E12 head using 8.1:1 to a maximum of 9.5:1. Macartney does not specify USA models, but that is understood since he is/was located in the UK. Historically speaking, and from direct experience, the fuel composition was changing at the time as Lead (and Octane rating) was being drastically reduced and compression ratios were thus reduced to deal with detonation in higher compression ratio engines. And too, SMOG controls were being introduced, where California led the way. My opinion today is that the late Tiis had a fuel cam to accommodate the above; subject to change without notice. That's all for today, the weeds in the yard are taunting me.
  3. Here is a tidbit data point. one of my pumps, 92004011 B-1, 3W 01852 dtd 10/72 likely came from SN: 2761362, a white sunroof car. the second, PLO4-124.02, A1 3X 008(?)00 dtd 6/73 Buried under layers of tarps is my (I believe) '72 Euro almost spec engine, 9.6:1, E12, early pump; i do not have the SN of that engine handy but I bought it from Franz Fechner and had Dave Cruz do the machine work, so i can't know what the plates say, but do have the data.....................somewhere. my first question is when did they go from plastic runners to metal? I would like to believe that the Euro cars had different pumps from the U.S. And further, those of you that have Precision Automotive Research rebuild your pump, can you provide the pump plate info, the casting date, and most importantly, the data readout from the calibration sheet for the P1, P2, P3 P4 curves? Since all the rebuilders save for PAR don't record the P curves' fuel it will be hard to really asses the differences in the pumps. That's it for now, Tii geeks.
  4. Steve; OK, so now we are on track to elucidate a big ol matrix of Serial numbers of the production, the engine whether US or Euro, the type of heads, CR, injection pumps' model, and fuel output curves. Yes? Alright, you sucked me into the vortex, because now I am really curious, but I'm gonna have to have some time to look at my references and perhaps measure everything again, because well, the memory doesn't always serve me as factual and I try not to succumb to loose conjecture. And sometimes I can't remember between the Tii, the Turbo, or the S14. What was the question? :) With all that, I can then run the numbers as far as trapped compression ratio and all that other fun mathematical stuff to really see what the differences are from a theoretical point.......bench engine building. I'll dig out my spare pumps and record that information, but may not necessarily have the associated VINs; casting dates may give a clue. I think the weeds in the yard will have to wait to be pulled............... I REALLY wanted to do that in the hot sun, 'cause it is SO Zen, but don't worry because they always "make more"! Ted
  5. Here's another thought to keeping the OE plastic runners: The volume of the plenum and the runners are different than the cast pieces. In addition, the plastic runner cars had a different head, CR, and injection pump fuel curves than the later cars. These all work in concert to provide a slightly different harmonic at various engine speeds and thus different positive pressure (over 14.7 psi) to the intake charge at and above peak torque. It is not much different, but it is. Yes, you can, and I have, changed to an E12 head, but you then need to change pistons and the injection pump fuel curves to accommodate that because the knock frequency changes, and all those "combustion considerations" as well depending on the fuel you use. So, if you want to change one component, then you must calculate the effects of your decision on the SYSTEM, and adjust accordingly, otherwise, don't muck up the engineering. Or just like so many back in the day who didn't understand the Tii, ......install (ugh) sidedrafts.
  6. A TRUE Tii has plastic runners! You can clean them up but that's about it. This is what dishwashers or Dawn soap is for. Yes, there were some "bad" batches of plastic, and the newer plastic is not as soft. If you have a collection of old pieces that are not cracked or the tabs have not broken off, keep them. Those reproductions are dumb, and muck up the harmonics of the intake. Now, about fitment, you MUST use the proper O rings, not some hardware store pieces. I don't know if you can get them from BMW or W&N but not just the size but the material as well.......it is softer an heat resistant. Use Teflon grease on the O rings and install them. Then, heat the tubes by boiling them or with a heat gun to soften up the flange. Orient the clamps as shown in the manual. Start with the bottom, and push until it begins to go on, then start pushing on the top until it goes all the way on. It is easier with the throttle body off. The clamps go over where the O ring is. Or "just" distal.The reason so many have failures is that they put the clamps too distal to the O rings which stresses the tabs. Yes, it's a frustrating job, because they tend to pop off before you get the clamps on Yes, I have always kept a few in the trunk as spares, or you can use plastic electrical tape in a pinch......say like at the airport long term lot.....but that's another story. You know after 100000 miles.......they tend to fail. The whole plenum setup is different from the metal units. PM me if you need the O ring size
  7. Buy the wheels and get a FREE car!
  8. My Grandfather told me he used to wipe a cut potato on the taxi cab windshield s he used to drive in San Francisco, as wipers had not been invented yet.......back in '10...... 1910. He was 14 at the time........ Isn't that the same?😀 They also had call boxes on the street corners to hail a cab. You know, the antique version of Uber. What is old is new again! But I digress. Seriously, I have used that Rain X since it was "NEW". Found I could even have the sunroof open and the wipers off at highway speeds in the Summertime thunderstorms. Will have to seek out Aquapel.... maybe it's made from potatoes..
  9. The OC 84 IIRC has a different bypass pressure.
  10. You really should use the factory air cleaner as the intake is pulse tuned to using that. Anything else is a step backwards. As far as the header, you can't go wrong with the stock manifold, and unless you measure the lengths and volumes of each cylinder tube, then calculate the resonance RPM owing to your cam and intake pulses, it might be a step back too, or at least sideways, with little benefit, but they may look good. The stock Tii manifold is not equal length so as to broaden the torque curve and make the engine less peaky. that said; You're pretty good here on WOT; the target should be 4.0%CO but certainly no more than 4.5%CO. That translates to AFR of 13 AFR to 12.83 respectively. But the thing to note is that when you go off throttle it will always go lean, for a second or three. That is because the pump output goes to the low RPM/Idle profile and it takes the engine a bit to catch up. See the diagram below. Since at that time there is no load on the engine, there is no problem. Conversely, when you are cruising at partial throttle and you stab the accelerator, there will be a short time where it will spike lean again until the needs of the engine and the pump coincide. I guess the point is that the AFR gauges are very sensitive, and not dampened, so you see every little change, not that it makes a whole lot of difference in the actual running of the engine. You DO need, however to make sure that there is no detonation, as the fuels today are not what the initial engine specifications call for e.g. 100 Octane. I have noted many times before that this system operates on FUEL DENSITY not strictly volume to the cylinders. Yes they are related but you have to accommodate for that in order for the system to be optimal. Since today's fuels have Methanol, the density is less than gas, and the amount of energy in each amount of fuel is less. You didn't mention which year car you have, early or late, U.S. or European. See below to note the differences in fuel requirements for the 121 and E12 heads. I don't have handy the differences between the early and late pumps vis a vis fuel output, but one difference is that the early pump favors running at 4000 RPM and also the idle P1 curve sharply decreases fuel output from 3000 RPM to 4000 RPM and higher, thus creating a lean spike upon deceleration. The later pump is more gradual. While the early pump is calibrated to the 121 head, it can be calibrated to match the E12 heads' flow and combustion characteristics. The other thing that you have not mentioned is your distributor curve, which is equally important to good tuning. for a compression ratio of 9.5 you do not want to have more than 34 deg. More is not more. If you do not have a map of your curve to validate, then I suggest you either have it put on a machine or use an advance timing light to do that. You want a smooth curve all the way up. Now, enough of the explanations; simply put, you first tune to WOT full load, (to do this you can be traveling at a particular RPM, then press the brake and accelerator simultaneously to keep the RPMs stable at full throttle, take a reading then release. I do that at 500 RPM increments from 3000 RPM on up, but you can do it in 1000 RPM increments) Get that right with your choice of fuel (when the weather and fuel changes with the seasons you will have to do it again) then tune to partial throttle, both under load transition and cruising by moving the D cam. Once that is right, then set your idle. Don't worry about the AFR at idle so much, it will be what it will be, only that it is smooth. Yes it is a tedious process, but you can get it. A little adjustment goes a long way. The good news is that once you get that all right, you shouldn't have to fiddle with it (like those Carburator guys) until you change fuels. Go forth and tune!
  11. it takes a keen eye to notice that Dave, I was mesmerized by the intake system..... So, where's Waldo?
  12. Hope Steve doesn't mind me posting these Paparazzi photos and mp4 of him on track yesterday. Sadly Steve wasn't around when I happened by, so I didn't say hi. I can say what a beautiful race car that checks all the boxes including transmission, differential coolers (via the low ductwork), and alternator running off the differential flanges. And of course the "Business End", with its ~9200 RPM redline. Well done, Steve, worth the wait. Looking forward to your videos..... Still searching if the initials "KW" are cast into those cam covers as a testament to my friend casting them at the BMW Foundry "back in the day"......... Enjoy.
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