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2 front subframe questions(torque related)


rjd2

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Hi folks-reassembling/rebuilding my front subframe and have two questions about nut torque:

 

1-I replaced the bushings in the steering idler arm. even with the "cap washer" off, when I torque the castle nut down, the notches don't rest low enough to seat a cotter pin. It's also super tight(this pertains to question #2 in some ways). What are people doing here, different castle nut? I could maybe get a nyloc on it, but that seems halfassed. It looks like I've got MAYBE 1mm of play on the top bushing, but i torqued the nut to ~60ft lbs and the bushings still arent sitting any closer.

 

2-I reassembled the front spindles today(new rotors, rebuilt calipers), and I found that if the castle nuts that hold the spindles to the "hub shafts"  are torqued down to the appropriate ft lbs for the nut size, the spindles dont spin. I backed them off to the point where they spin freely, and put a cotter pin in and installed the cap, but those nuts have effectively no torque on them, and are only being held in place by the cotter pins. Is this the proper installation or am I botching something somewhere?

 

Thanks for the help.

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Hi,

 

1. A photo would help us spot if there is something wrong. I'm literally working on the same thing and here is a photo of mine. I understand the recommended torque is 10NM, enough to be snug but definitely not tight. I haven't add the cotter pin yet but the holes line up. Perhaps the new idler bushings aren't pushed in enough?

image.jpeg.8f1171fde4ad219a036aa702f0962847.jpeg

 

 

2. Torqueing the nut to spec for its size is too tight for sure. I'm not yet around to this on my rebuild but if memory serves tighten the nut so that you just remove play and stop there. Yes, that cotter pin is super important.

 

Others will have more guidance I am sure!

 

Jason

 

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1973 2002tii (2764167), Baikal, sunroof, A/C, 5spd OD, 3.91 LSD, etc. Rebuild blog here!

In the past: Verona H&B 1973 2002tii (2762913); Malaga 1975 2002; White 1975 2002

--> Blog: Repro tii cold start relay;   --> If you need an Alpina A4 tuning manual, PM me!

 

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Take a look at the idler arm nut in Jason's picture: it's quite short, probably for  good reason--so the castle nut will allow you to engage the cotter pin in its crenelations (notches).  Does your nut match that in the picture?  If it does, then something is wrong as it was pinned properly when you took it apart, wasn't it?

 

As for the wheel bearing/spindle nut:  you don't torque those to a specific setting.  Run the nut up with a wrench to seat everything firmly, then spin the hub.  If it spins freely without wobbling, then pin it and be done.  If it wobbles, tighten it some more, spin and check for wobble.  If it doesn't spin at all, back it off to the first notch where the cotter pin aligns with the spindle's hole, and see if it spins without resistance.  If so, you're done; if not, back it off another notch until it does spin freely.   

 

Once you think you have it, temporarily reinstall the wheel and see if you can rock it by grabbing the edge of the tire at 12 and 6 o'clock and see if it'll wobble.  

 

BTW, years ago there were companies that made two piece castle nuts:  a plain nut with a pressed steel cap that fit over the nut.  Then you could adjust the spindle nut to a wobble-free point, and install the cap to align the crenelations to the cotter pin hole.  Much more precise.  Never seen one for a BMW, though.

 

mike

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'69 Nevada sunroof-Wolfgang-bought new
'73 Sahara sunroof-Ludwig-since '78
'91 Brillantrot 318is sunroof-Georg Friederich 
Fiat Topolini (Benito & Luigi), Renault 4CVs (Anatole, Lucky Pierre, Brigette) & Kermit, the Bugeye Sprite

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Wheel bearing adjustment-- 

 

From the "blue book"

Section 31 20 004, page 31-20/1

While constantly turning the wheel nub, tighten castellated nut to a torque of 22 to 24 ft*lbs. When this torque has been reached, the taper rollers and inner bearing races will be in position correctly. This also ensures that any grease which would cause undesired play is pressed out.

After tightening, give the complete bearing assembly at least another 2 turns without either loosening or further tightening of the castellated nut.

Loosen castellated nut until bearing endplay is detected, and hub rotates with nut. Then, tighten castellated nut to max 2.2 ft*lbs, slacken to nearest hole and secure with split pin. Slotted washer should move easily, without noticeable resistance.

 

From "T" (back in 2008)

Standard 2002-

I leave mine loose enough that there's the

slightest of 'clicks' when you rock the wheel top- to- bottom.

No movement- too tight.

'CLunK'- too loose.

The tii seems to like just a bit tighter- right at 'no click'.

fwiw.

t

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That nut on the idler is called a 1/2 nut and is considerably shorter than a full nut. It's important as John said to rotate the hub when tightening it, after torqueing it I back the nut off until I can just shift the tanged washer underneath the castle nut with a screw driver and a bit of a push.

If everybody in the room is thinking the same thing, then someone is not thinking.

 

George S Patton 

Planning the Normandy Break out 1944

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thanks yall! well I don't think i'm far off on the hub; that's just about what i did. torqued down, backed off til the hub spun free, tightened til there was no play and a decent spin.

 

i don't know if mine got changed or what, but the nut on my idler arm is deeper than the castle nuts on the hubs. to even get close to a cotter pin going in it, i'd have to drill it out or replace it....

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17 hours ago, rjd2 said:

thanks yall! well I don't think i'm far off on the hub; that's just about what i did. torqued down, backed off til the hub spun free, tightened til there was no play and a decent spin.

 

i don't know if mine got changed or what, but the nut on my idler arm is deeper than the castle nuts on the hubs. to even get close to a cotter pin going in it, i'd have to drill it out or replace it....

 

I'd replace it. Crown nut PN for the idler: 07119923465 (need to confirm but looks like it).

 

~Jason

 

 

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1973 2002tii (2764167), Baikal, sunroof, A/C, 5spd OD, 3.91 LSD, etc. Rebuild blog here!

In the past: Verona H&B 1973 2002tii (2762913); Malaga 1975 2002; White 1975 2002

--> Blog: Repro tii cold start relay;   --> If you need an Alpina A4 tuning manual, PM me!

 

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