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1602 engine to a 2002 engine what do I need?


Hansome
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I have an ageing 1602 engine and wanted to step it up to a 2.0 - can I use my current block and crank or does the crank need to be swapped too? I wondered if there was also a good source for building these engines eg a reference book or similar. I have rebuilt several engines (air-cooled VW and SBC's) so that's not the issues just gaining the knowledge of what's require is 

thanks

H

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Hi - 

What I should have added is I'm in the UK and the car is in Portugal (finding anything engine wise is difficult and because its old its seen a vintage and parts carry a higher cost) so I'm building in the UK and shipping over to fit, but changing anything from original on a car is either not allowed (hence very limited customising scene) unlike UK, USA etc or there is a financial penalty which not being native I don't know or could possibly understand how to find that info.

Hence wanting to use the same block because numbers would match with documents for the yearly inspection ?

I agree finding a 2L might be easier  - if not for the above 

Tech71 boring the block is probably a no go - so it seems I need a 2L block to start me off.

Not many engines come up for sale in the UK I don't know why? just have to keep looking

 

thanks H

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2 hours ago, Hansome said:

Hence wanting to use the same block because numbers would match with documents for the yearly inspection ?

 

2 hours ago, Hansome said:

seems I need a 2L block to start me off.

Your contradicting yourself here, any 2L block you find will  most likely be marked with a VIN and won’t march your cars

Portugal, Uk, sounds convoluted. 
You could squeeze some extra power out of your original 1.6L engine and keep whatever version of TUV you have to deal with off your case

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You couldn't achieve a full two liters displacement, but if you wanted to overbore your 1600 block say 2mm (there should be enough meat in the block to do so, but to go over a 1mm overbore would require custom pistons) and then use a 2 liter crank, you'd end up with a displacement somewhere between the original 1600 and two liters.  The factory created the 1802 by doing just the opposite:  2 liter (89mm) pistons and the 1600 (71mm) crank.  Just a thought.  BMW managed to squeeze 2.5 liters out of a 2 liter S14 by using a longer throw crank and it worked.  

 

mike

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42 minutes ago, Mike Self said:

 ..The factory created the 1802 by doing just the opposite:  2 liter (89mm) pistons and the 1600 (71mm) crank.  Just a thought.  BMW managed to squeeze 2.5 liters out of a 2 liter S14 by using a longer throw crank and it worked.  

 

mike

Original factory recipe for 1,8l m10  was 80mm crank with 84mm pistons in 1800 NeueKlasse. That would be achievable with the original block.

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4 hours ago, Tommy said:

Original factory recipe for 1,8l m10  was 80mm crank with 84mm pistons in 1800 NeueKlasse. That would be achievable with the original block.

Although I'd suggest going the 2 Liter Engine route I can confirm that this is feasible. 
I did that on my convertible where I wanted to keep the engine#
2 Liter Crank 1800 Neue Klasse Longstroke Pistons and a couple of other additions added up to invisible 108 hp.

Edited by uai
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14 hours ago, tech71 said:

 

Your contradicting yourself here, any 2L block you find will  most likely be marked with a VIN and won’t march your cars

Portugal, Uk, sounds convoluted. 
You could squeeze some extra power out of your original 1.6L engine and keep whatever version of TUV you have to deal with off your case

I have indeed ...... I guess I'm trying to work the best option and when I reference the 2l block it would mean here in the UK - build up and take to Portugal - do the swap and then do the work on the 1600 matching numbers - so I have a usable vehicle when I'm there. 

food for thought methinks

 

?

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The racers back in the middle '60's used the long stroke 1800 (1600 bore and 2liter stroke) engines bored to 89mm to run in the Under 2 liter class in sports cars.  It can be done but I recommend you have the block sonic checked to make sure the cylinder walls are thick enough to get away with it. 

 

What is the inspection process for your cars that the engine serial number is checked to match the actual car?  Is it OK to swap a different engine (from the same year and model)?  How knowledgeable are they about the cars?  Are they just looking at the VIN on the block or would they also look a the date stamps cast into the block?  Would they know the difference between a 118 head (1600/1800) and a 121/E12/E21 head from a 2 liter or even a later 1.8 head?    

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