Sunroof assembly problems... Help please!

[pehlivanov_tii]

Hi guys,

I wrote another topic about this 2-3 months ago. Dlacey and Jgerock shared some thoughts on it and I appreciate this a lot, but the problem still exists. 
Main problem: It is a power sunroof which can’t fully close. It slides perfect but it can’t make the final move - the rear part of the panel to lift up and seal the roof.

 

What I tried? I made new plastic sliders on 3D printer and replaced them on the OEM BMW cables. Everything is lubed perfectly. Power motor has been completely refurbished. I tried with different drive gear - it is the same. I tried to change the height position on the slider.

 

Question - what majes these sunroof to make their final move and to lift to get in line with the roof? On many articles on the bet they say that when the cable bracket hit the round bump / nut that’s lifting up the panel. Like this

- to my opinion is not this when the panel is mounted my cable doesn’t even reach the round nub. 
See pictures - when the panel is not mounted yet the cable can reach the round nub like on the photo above. In this position when i try to mount the panel on the cables, on like closed position like this

 

and look at the back - see the holes dont match and i cant mount the panel to the cables:

and if i want to mount the panel on the cable i have to slide back the cables so the holes to match. But in this position there is a space between the cable and round nub:

so the point is that there must be something else that makes the roof to pop up.

 

The other theory is that marked trapezoid detail (on the photo above) to get in contact with the round nub instead of the cable itself? It is very close but still dont touch it...

 

Please help me because i am stuck with this stupid problem from a long time. 
Is there anyone who can unclip their headliner and make a short video to see what happens inside when the sunroof is closing??? I will be grateful forever...

 

[irdave]

It's a little bit early here still, but I will be working on my car today- and I have no sunroof panel on- and I just replaced one of the cables.  So give me a couple hours...

[jgerock]

I’m wondering if the (closed position) limit switch in the electric gear motor is incorrectly positioned or faulty.

 

Yes- I read where you tried a different motor.

 

The physical roof must go all the way forward, with or without the gear motor or cables connected.

[7502]

I feel your pain on this topic. Since you said yours is a power sunroof I guess we have to assume the motor is working properly and able to move the cable throughout its' range.  One thing I notice is you might try to reposition the adjustable fasteners upward as shown in below.

 

Good luck.

Eric

 

 

[jgerock]

14 minutes ago, 7502 said:

I feel your pain on this topic. Since you said yours is a power sunroof I guess we have to assume the motor is working properly and able to move the cable throughout its' range.  One thing I notice is you might try to reposition the adjustable fasteners upward as shown in below.

 

Good luck.

Eric

 

 

I was going to suggest the same thing, but the roof insert must go more forward for the rise to start happening.

[pehlivanov_tii]

@jgerock I don't think the motor has a limit and actually can be adjusted. It just works forward and backward until the cables hit something and once they can't continue moving then the motor stops (even the button is still pushed). This is how i think it is. Also, when the panel is not mounted there is no limit, the cables are being driven by the motor freely and perfect through their entire range. Even when i put the panel they still move very fast and perfect, but the rear part of the panel just can't lift up.

 

By the way, I have a manual drive gear and handle, I can try it, but I'm not sure the problem is that much in the fact that the sunroof is electric. This is why I hope to get help and advises from manual sunroof owners too.

 

@7502 I tried already in this position too. It is the same. Like Jim said the panel must start lifting to feel the effect of this change. Thank you anyway!

[irdave]

Is the motor stopping because it sees a load increase and decides that's where it needs to stop?  Which is before it pulls the roof all the way closed?  I'd be interested to see if it works by hand...

[pehlivanov_tii]

@irdave Yes, this is how it works on my car. Let's imagine the roof is opened, i.e. the panel is back. You push the button to close it, it slides perfectly until the moment the sunroof panel reach the front side of the roof, with the grey weatherstrip, and stops there. When looking from top it's closed, but actually it stops before trying to lift the rear part up. If the thing is that the motor is let's say lazy and stops too easy I guess in the manual version there wouldn't be this problem, because you can push it a little bit more by hand. But there must be some way, after all there are other electric sunroofs too. By the way, the motor didn't work when I got the car, I send it to a service and they told me that cleaned everything inside and inside it is like new, and actually it really runs very fast and looks powerful.

[stephers]

It may be that your cables and the transmission are not " synched " together     Try taking the transmission piece out  ( this is the part that drives the 2 cables from the driveshaft between the motor and itself )     The push the sunroof panel into the fully closed position , then push both cables into the fully open position .   turn your transmission piece all the way one way, it will come to a stop, back it up a little and refit it to the cables     Try moving the sunroof by hand crank first to see if it works properly. You may find that you have rotated the trans piece the wrong way, just rotate back the other way and do the same thing once fully rotated        Try this out, it may fix your problem

 

Thanks, Rick

[pehlivanov_tii]

@stephers thank you very much. I tried that because it makes sense. Unmounted the electric mechanism and installed an old one manual. I was hoping that if i put a little more pressure to it but not so much will do the work. However this is the result. When the cables were about to lift the panel and there was no other place to go I pushed a little bit more (but not so much) and the weakest parts broke - 2 cables. I will have to print new plastic pieces or just try with metal ones. The most important - the panel didnt lift from itself. I don’t know if it would lift if the cables didn’t broke...

[jgerock]

You have found the weak link to the BMW cables.

[dlacey]

14 hours ago, pehlivanov_tii said:

 

 

 

 

 

The motor really just replaces the human hand, it just turns the drive gear until the mechanical resistance causes it to stall, same as you do with your hand. As said, a good condition motor is quite powerful when battery condition is OK, and very powerful when on alternator volts.

The 'hinge parts' in the photo above should be loose, easy to move with your fingers, the only tight/fixed part should be the screw that connects the serrated 'height setting' parts together. Is the small cast alloy part free to pivot in the plastic slider??. As i understand it, thats how it works: The cables are being pulled forward by the motor (or handcrank), when the front edge of the panel touches the aperture lip the panel can no-longer move forward. Further forward motion pressure on plastic slider (via cables/motor) forces the alloy hinge piece to swing upwards, pushing the rear of the panel up. On my roof this upward swing is just due to the pressure from the cables and the resistance of the panel movement. The alloy part does not hit the round nub, maybe it would if the aperture seal wasnt there.

[pehlivanov_tii]

@dlaceyYes everything seems like you said. I just found in my garage metal cable brackets like the volvo one. There was a donor car few years ago and I got the cables from there. I guess when I change them they would hold up better. 
 

[irdave]

[irdave]

Rotate your screen to the right, clockwise.  Not sure why the phone did that to me.  But the video starts closed, moves to open, then back to closed.  Let me know if there is more you'd like to see.