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silasmoon

Guibo Bolts Loosening

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(edited)

About a year ago my guibo shredded itself. I had a well known 2002 mechanic in the CA Bay Area do the work. About 2,500 mi later the guibo bolts started backing out. I noticed as one of them started slapping my shift linkage sounding like a buzzsaw. Got the car up - and tightened about 3 of the bolts. One of them was very loose. Inspection revealed the guibo was installed with old / pre-existing bolts. My question is - should I replace the entire guibo, or can I get away with just swapping the bolts and nuts out? I also noticed that all the nuts were facing the "front" of the car, while the bolt heads faced the rear. I know they guibos are apparently directional. 

Thoughts? Doing a rally in two weeks, and frankly don't want to swap the guibo, since I have less than 3,000 miles on it. ?

Edited by silasmoon

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I'd spend the extra money for a new guibo now so you don't end up having to worry about it failing and doing more damage 

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Yah - I think that is the wiser option. Do I need to be ablw to get the car four tires off the ground to swap it? I might just have a local BMW tech do it. It's pretty straight forward in terms of universal joints ya? 

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Yah - I think that is the wiser option. Do I need to be ablw to get the car four tires off the ground to swap it? I might just have a local BMW tech do it. It's pretty straight forward in terms of universal joints ya? 

Change the guibo and the nuts and bolts. Ask how I know. aa6b3171739fd329ad594554c57a94ad.jpg
Shredded the seal on the shift linkage too. You should jack all four tires up to get you hands in and around the guibo/drive shaft. Will need the spin the shaft to get at all the nuts.
Roman


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It is a good idea for the nuts to all be facing forward. If the bolt is facing forward and the nut pops off the bold will back off into your transmission, ripping the back out of the tranny. Seen it happen.

 

I would also be using nylocs or lock tight on the bolts and maybe double check the alignment of the driveshaft.

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2 hours ago, Stevenc22 said:

It is a good idea for the nuts to all be facing forward. If the bolt is facing forward and the nut pops off the bold will back off into your transmission, ripping the back out of the tranny. Seen it happen.

 

I would also be using nylocs or lock tight on the bolts and maybe double check the alignment of the driveshaft.

 

Sorry Steven, I couldn't disagree more.

 

The factory set up is "guibo specific bolts and nuts" oriented in staggered formation.  The bolts are uncommon in that the heads are larger than normal.  I don't have the exact measurements but I think the heads are 17mm on a 10mm thread vs. the standard 14mm head on generic 10mm bolts.

The head size gives better coverage on the guibo face.  Generic bolts can twist easier with the smaller head.

 

Also, orientation of the bolts is important as the heads need to be flush with the flanges which are staggered. 

 

I tried to save money once and used generic bolts and nylocks.  Twisted and backed out on me and caused nothing but grief.  One time that OEM is a valuable purchase.  IMHO

 

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, PaulTWinterton said:

Also, orientation of the bolts is important as the heads need to be flush with the flanges which are staggered. 

+1  The bolt/nut orientation is alternating--facing front and back--per Paul's statement above...This is not a place to cheap charlie with generic nuts and bolts.  That's penny wise and pound foolish!

 

mike

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7 minutes ago, PaulTWinterton said:

 

Sorry Steven, I couldn't disagree more.

 

The factory set up is "guibo specific bolts and nuts" oriented in staggered formation.  The bolts are uncommon in that the heads are larger than normal.  I don't have the exact measurements but I think the heads are 17mm on a 10mm thread vs. the standard 14mm head on generic 10mm bolts.

The head size gives better coverage on the guibo face.  Generic bolts can twist easier with the smaller head.

 

Also, orientation of the bolts is important as the heads need to be flush with the flanges which are staggered. 

 

I tried to save money once and used generic bolts and nylocks.  Twisted and backed out on me and caused nothing but grief.  One time that OEM is a valuable purchase.  IMHO

 

 

 

 

correct.  use the right bolts and locking nuts....

 

---and----

 

put them in correctly.  the direction alternates such that the head of the bolt is on the quibo.  the nut is against the flange.  only turn the nut when tightening.

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(edited)

I had mine loosen a number of times and re-tightened them, and/or swapped bolts.  If the guibo looks fine its probably better not to mess with it and screw more stuff up.   The guibo only starts shredding itself after you lose a couple bolts.  If you don't get bolts super tight, they wiggle out, independent of guibo status.  I use red loc-tite and tighten the hell out of them now.

Use OEM bolts and OEM locking nuts, they're not nylocks.  The OEMs are all metal and special to dig in tight.  Nylocks aren't great for a second use, if you have to do that.  I usually hit nylocs with a torch to melt it a little for a re-use, but figure it's not quite as good as they were new. 

And yeah, there's a proper pattern and direction for the bolts, I forget the details.  

And sure, many cars can get away with using cheapo nylocks barely tightened, and it works fine for years.  That's because they may have everything well balanced and aligned perfectly.  If stuff isn't quite perfect, those bolts loosen up.  I used every method and tool to try to align my driveshaft, but still guibo bolts would get loose if I didn't loc-tite and tighten the holy hell out of them.

I eventually remedied my problem by switching to a 5-speed with a better 6 bolt guibo.  

 

For your purposes though for the drive, I'd just loc-tite or upgrade hardware as you can, and tighten the holy hell out of each bolt, and check on them periodically.

Edited by KFunk

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The replacement BMW giubo mounting hardware includes 17mm (wrench size) bolts and 16mm (wrench size) locking type hex nuts that are slightly deformed when examining the outer edge.  There is a specific term for these nuts - cannot recall what they are at the moment.

 

Old picture

pics112010032.jpg

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As always I greatly appreciate the help from everyone. ?

 

I need to look into alligning the output flange on the transmission as well. I live in SF and figure the parking in gear and other inclined angles aren't doing my any favors. 

 

?

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5 hours ago, jgerock said:

The replacement BMW giubo mounting hardware includes 17mm (wrench size) bolts and 16mm (wrench size) locking type hex nuts that are slightly deformed when examining the outer edge.  There is a specific term for these nuts - cannot recall what they are at the moment.

 

Old picture

pics112010032.jpg

 

giubo ✓  ?

 

spacer.png

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7 hours ago, PaulTWinterton said:

 

Sorry Steven, I couldn't disagree more.

 

The factory set up is "guibo specific bolts and nuts" oriented in staggered formation.  The bolts are uncommon in that the heads are larger than normal.  I don't have the exact measurements but I think the heads are 17mm on a 10mm thread vs. the standard 14mm head on generic 10mm bolts.

The head size gives better coverage on the guibo face.  Generic bolts can twist easier with the smaller head.

 

Also, orientation of the bolts is important as the heads need to be flush with the flanges which are staggered. 

 

I tried to save money once and used generic bolts and nylocks.  Twisted and backed out on me and caused nothing but grief.  One time that OEM is a valuable purchase.  IMHO

 

 

 

 

Never said anything about using generic bolts or nuts, just that you need to have some sort of mechanical means of locking the nut to the bolt. Locking nut or loctite. I would never use a generic bolt for this application.

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