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Anti-roll/sway bars upgrade

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Hi 02 community, 

 

I am thinking of an upgrade for my anti-roll bars. Because my Touring is having too much body roll in the corners. Is it going to make a noticeable difference if I change all of the rubber anti-roll bar bushings for Strongflex and Powerflex polyurethane ones? All of the suspension is still stock. See under here for the product I am talking about. 

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I've also looked into the option of installing Ireland Engineering 22mm anti-roll bars. But it will cost me like €500,- instead of €150,- for the bushings upgrade. 

 

I would like to know what you guys think about this. Thanks in advance!

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(edited)

It won't be recognisable except your current rubbers are completely gone.
Probably more like a placebo effect similar when people have better pedal feel after changing to braided Brake lines.

And while it might make sense to have the two bushings in the front changed where the sway bar pivots, it might be nonsese to put PU on the pushrods. So either balljoints / rosejoints or standard imho.
Perhaps there's a practical replacement with some OE Parts for the pushrods. With adjustable swaybars some guys over here change to some shortened ones from Smart cars. 

I went old style and used Fluro rosejoints

IMG_3343.JPG

Edited by uai
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I would upgrade to IE sway bars front and rear. It will be the most and quite possibly the best upgrade you could do to correct body roll, without sacrificing the comfort from your stack suspension. Obviously there will be some stiffening over uneven roads going straight.
fwiw
Matt


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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(edited)

Some years ago I installed 22mm front and 19mm rear bars on my '73, and used urethane bushings on both the mounts and the end links.  This is the only place you can use urethane bushings without compromising ride quality, as the sway bar bushings only come into play while cornering, and with less compliance than rubber, the sway bars effects will be felt much quicker (no compression to speak of).  

 

I also installed H&R lowering springs along with my 130k mile Bilstein HD shocks, and it makes for a very nice ride and much improved cornering, even with stock rubber bushings elsewhere in the suspension (no more scrapes on rocker panels or door handles from excessive body lean).

 

mike

 

 

Edited by mike

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First, what is "too much body roll" for you? Don't confuse body roll with the ability to corner up to a certain G value. Today's sticky tires will go further in a higher cornering force than any other upgrade. Just look up images of the race 2002s of the era and see the amount of body roll they had.......

 

But I think you can do this in stages if you wish.

 

Changing just the pivot bushings will help with the axial movement or the bar without adding / creating harshness in your general ride.

 

I am not an advocate of the urethane end link bushings, for even casual track use. They tend to disintegrate and don't allow compliance for street use. I use the stock bushings there so the sharp bumps on the street are somewhat ameliorated.

 

i do think a 22-25mm bar upfront is a good upgrade, but think a 19mm bar in the rear for street use is too much, unless you like that "nervous feeling" in the rear of the car, or frequently load up the back with your "stuff". I use a 16mm bar in the rear, for street and track.

 

Of course the difference in spring rates between a 13" rim and tire vs. a 15" rim and tire will also affect the feel of your suspension, particularly in quick transitional movement.

 

Stepping back a bit, the sway bars are part of the suspension SYSTEM, so ultimately should be matched with the springs, the shocks, and yes, even the size of the rims and tires. You also need to asses what makes you happy in your driving experience; is it cruising without pressing the car too hard, or occasional "canyon carving", or the feeling of a full out race suspension?

 

 

 

 

 

 

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(edited)

Isn't 22 front way too much unless you have 100kg/cm springs?
For a street setup, I'd rather go alpina style 18-19 front with 16 rear and increase spring rate if that's too soft.

But I've never driven a 22mm front, and I like it tail happy

Edited by uai

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no.  take a look at the design as well.

 

There's a reason the IE swaybars are consistently mentioned when someone asks about about peoples "favorite modification".

 

Andrew Wilson's nailed it.

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I am a big fan of ST bars for street fun use.

 

The design flaw in the IE bars is the end links.  It is actually the design flaw in all 2002 bars, but IE could have fixed it with their product.

 

I use modified IE bars front and rear on my track ME.

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27 minutes ago, AceAndrew said:

There's a reason the IE swaybars are consistently mentioned when someone asks about about peoples "favorite modification".

 

 

 

 

Hang on ... is a ‘favorite’ or ‘popular’ modification / option / product necessarily the best one? And, best for all people

(separating marketing from engineering, Andrew - it’s fun) -KB

 

 

 

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Here is a strong vote for Mike's and Andrew's superb aforementioned suggestions (same ones they made to me a couple of years ago).  

  • ST sway bars (23/19)
  • Bilstein HD shocks/inserts
  • H&R sport springs

Great upgrade and balance of street/road/aggressive/twisty performance and ride.  Even better with all new OEM rubber bushings (urethane for sway bushings).

 

After upgrade to heavier SB, the old/original SB look like coat hanger wire.

 

maf_cars_2019-24.thumb.jpg.df89c7ab38ec3014c52855a17c8b6f53.jpg

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I too like the ST 22/19 bar set AND their springs for a street car.

 

Thingy is, an anti- sway bar is just a spring, and not a particularly

strong one at that.   

 

Lots of ways to go, but trying to fight soft springs with stiff bars

is one of them.

 

t

 

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1 hour ago, kbmb02 said:

Hang on ... is a ‘favorite’ or ‘popular’ modification / option / product necessarily the best one?

 

Physics and engineering usually says "no" if you analyze the current offerings.

 

In the end personal preference is subjective; so if you think super stiff suspension is the "best", then great. If you like "plush", great too. I'd say don't fall into the trap of "well, if it has the stamp of brand XXX then it is the best". I did decades ago, and even the company owner who drove the car said it was crap.

 

I prefer to model the car at the outset to see the ramifications of each part of the system, then come to a decision to my liking.

 

Everyone loves a different flavor, make mine at least sticky tires.

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My first Suspension version was:

Voghtech -1-1/4" drop springs

KYB Struts/Shocks

New Strut bearings

IE front and rear Sway Bars

 

this was a very compliant spirted street set up, not for track but Ok in basic canyons. Some people are very negative about KYB's but almost everyone who rode in my car was very complimentary of the characteristics.

 

Now I'm full coil overs with Camber/Caster adjusters front and rear. Great when pushing but it rattles like CRAZY over every bump. 

 

IMG_3536.thumb.JPG.61519dcf5d6dcae133ae161ac67a046a.JPGIMG_3535.thumb.JPG.48b1268c459f1b36f9d73f7128fe0c9e.JPG

 

 

 

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