02 Values too High

[Slavs]

The values of these cars are too high. Most parts and service vendors, especially the newcomers, have adjusted their prices accordingly. And unless you have some serious money, these cars are not for you. I don’t intend on selling my cars, but what some vendors are asking for parts and services is simply “Rape”. I’ve spent the best years of my life building and driving 02s on a budget, including my student days. This is no longer possible, nor is the hobby very fun. There are a lot of helpful and generous 02 comrades out there. But, The 02 community has also been hijacked by flippers, speculators and the melon vendors from the bazaar. That’s my nay-say for the day.

[tech71]

"melon venders from the bazaar," priceless dude.

Supply and demand unfortunately.  If we'd only known..

[NYNick]

Yeah, no.

 

I've heard this rant for years on the Porsche forums. Just because you were an early proponent of 02's doesn't give you the right to hoard the feeling for yourself forever. Rather, you should relish the fact that these cars are finally getting the recognition they long deserved and be proud of yourself for knowing that for so long before everyone else did. That means you were smart and knew a good thing when you drove it.

 

Don't ruin it for yourself by being bitter. Swim in the ocean of recognized coolness and continue to love and drive your cars you discovered so early.

 

Look at it this way: you were a leader in the field. Celebrate, don't denigrate.

[dang]

6 minutes ago, NYNick said:

Don't ruin it for yourself by being bitter. Swim in the ocean of recognized coolness and continue to love and drive your cars you discovered so early.

 

Nah, I'm on my fifth E9 coupe and I should've kept all of them.  Slavs speaks for a lot of us.  When you've lived through the times when you could find a nice 2002 at a tax donation yard or have someone tell you "Hey, my neighbor has one of those in his yard you can have" it just feels a little depressing the way things are now.  It was more about the find, the chase and the "good deal" than anything else.  The "good deals" now are when you find a $15k car for $12k.  It just feels completely different, and hard to swallow the prices.

[Slavs]

Supply and Demand economic theory is about as baseless as the so called “Invisible Hand”. I’m not about to engage you guys in how value is determined nor am I proponent of myths and fables for little kids, which is what they teach you in Business and Econ classes in school. I’ve been that route. But, many of you will also be priced out of this hobby. It’s sad what happened to Porsche values. We used to buy and drive Porsche 356 and 912s when we were 19, with funds we earned from pizza delivery jobs. And look what happened now. This has left a very bitter taste in my mouth.

[AlfaBMWGuy]

I was thinking the original post sounded really familiar....

 

https://www.bmw2002faq.com/forums/topic/229746-02-prices-values/

[1936spyder]

I agree with Nick and Dang; there are completely valid points to both sides of the argument.

 

I will say though that I knew if I wasn't able to get my most recent car at the price that I purchased it for, then I would be priced out of the community in short order as I don't have the deepest pockets in the world. Granted, it is a tii but even clean driver 02's are commanding a decent amount of money now.

 

Regarding parts, I think that's a gripe that all share. As we all know some things available from BMW have gone through the roof price-wise over the last few years. That's been a bit of a game-changer as well especially if you only have the means to purchase a project which would then obviously entail the sourcing and purchading of that many more parts, new or used.

 

It is what it is, supply and demand definitely being a component but not the only variable. It was inevitable that it would happen to 02's eventually, although they seem to have more multi-generational enthusiasts than say tri-Chevys or muscle cars for example. Those cars have largely peaked already with the exception of the most desirable examples.

 

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[uai]

+1 having heard this all over on the porsche forums

Then buy e36 or e46 and don't complain - still cheap.
It's just a matter of which people are now between 35 and 50 and which cars were cool when they were a child or started driving.

My wife bought bought her 964 10 Years ago the 3.0 CSi 14 years ago I bought my 1600-2 Convertible 2007 (sold it 2013) with the e34 touring M5 I've waited a little too long for the perfect car and missed the perfect time to buy for 2 years but got it in 2013.

Just buy the right car at the right time. And if it's too expensive sell one you don't use to afford another one like I did with the 1600 Convertible in favor of the M5 touring - was the right choice for me.

Edited May 6, 2019 by uai

[1936spyder]

+1 having heard this all over on the porsche forums Then buy e36 or e46 and don't complain - still cheap.

It's just a matter of which people are now between 35 and 50 and which cars were cool when they were a child or started driving.

My wife bought bought her 964 10 Years ago the 3.0 CSi 14 years ago I bought my 1600-2 Convertible 2007 (sold it 2013) with the e34 touring M5 I've waited a little too long for the perfect car and missed the perfect time to buy for 2 years but got it in 2013.

Just buy the right car at the right time. And if it's too expensive sell one you don't use to afford another one like I did with the 1600 Convertible in favor of the M5 touring - was the right choice for me.

 

Right, which is what I was basically alluding to with tri-Chevys, early T-birds, '59 Caddies, muscle cars, etc (and more recently, air-cooled Porsches as you mentioned). As we all know, when those were new teenagers/recent college grads couldn't afford them but when they got to a certain age and had some disposable income to indulge those old dreams and desires, they did. Speculators and flippers always get pulled along with things like that which only increases values further, for better or worse.

 

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[Mike G]

As a means of transportation my 02 is pretty reasonable. Decent gas mileage, easy to work on, most parts are affordable compared to newer cars. 

 

As a hobby it’s practically free compared to building snowmobiles from scratch or flying. The exhaust for my current snowmobile project cost six times what my tii manifold is worth. The engine is worth four times as much as my tii engine. 

 

Just because 02’s used to be cheaper doesn’t mean they’re a poor value now. If the hobby really isn’t fun anymore then move on. 

[2002Scoob]

But... but.... Fables and lore of 75 dollar LSD's, and 150 dollar 245 Getrags.... I paid too much for my lil' POS car that I've dumped way too much into, and still feel like i got in ahead of the curve. Lets see how values hold when Petrol is no longer a valid fuel source  I'm lookin' at you, tii market....

Edited May 6, 2019 by 2002Scoob

[1936spyder]

But... but.... Fables and lore of 75 dollar LSD's, and 150 dollar 245 Getrags.... I paid too much for my lil' POS car that I've dumped way too much into, and still feel like i got in ahead of the curve. Lets see how values hold when Petrol is no longer a valid fuel source [emoji6] I'm lookin' at you, tii market....

It will definitely be interesting to see what happens to the collector car market re: values and driving constraints over the course of the next decade (and further) as fuel becomes even more expensive and emissions/pollution laws/regulations become more restrictive.

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[NYNick]

Sorry guys, but it sure sounds like a bunch of sour grapes to me. Here's a news flash; We're not 19 and it isn't 1969 anymore. Things change. "Get off my lawn" is an old man's adage that I refuse to endorse while being considered one.

 

Todays 19 year olds are buying Miatas and EFI Civics because they're cheap, easy to fix and fun to drive. Sound familiar? It should. That's why we bought muscle cars and $2000 356's back in the day. Cheap, easy to fix and fun to drive. So what if 40 year olds like and bid up the price of 02's? It's about time!

 

It's a hobby. It's small potatoes. It really doesn't matter. 

 

Misery (or bitterness) is optional. I choose being content and happy.

[dang]

Okay fine, I'll just sell all my BMW's and retire then.  ?   How's that for bitter!

[Greg_Tchilinguirian]

The 2002 bubble has made me hate filling up at the gas station. Lately the conversations have been ending in "its not for sale".

 

These cars used to be low key enough to drive without having to engage in idle chit chat or "how much is it worth" at every fill up. Only folks who once owned one or had an 02 experience better than "I saw one like that on BAT go for XX,XXX" would engage. I miss those days..

 

Luckily like most speculative bubbles this one will burst (or wilt like a tulip) at some point and these cars will go back to being curiosities. The johhny come lately crowd will scatter and move on to the next flavor of kewl.

 

Fingers crossed.

 

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