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Nice 13 X 5.5” Campagnolos on Bring a Trailer


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32 minutes ago, resra said:

 I think the 4x98 market is lot more narrower than the 4x100 market!

 

Unless you’re more familiar with the Italian market than I, I don’t know if that’s true: I’ve seen these on more Fiats than on BMW’s. Campy’s are Italian rims, and their primary market was...Italy.

 

I bought all six of my Ragno’s out of Italy (five now, as I gave up one so another Ragno owner could complete a set of five) in two, or was it three, tranches, where all had most recently served on Fiats. Yes, all six of mine were presumed to be 4x98 (if the owners even knew what PCD was!). Four of the six were 4x100, two of the six were 4x98, and two of them were advertised as 4x108.... ? Not a lot of careful measuring going on there.... ?

 

I saw the “40714” cast into each rim and — wrongly, it turned out — assumed they were all model 40714 (4x100). I didn’t realize that Campy drilled the same blanks 4x100 for model 40714 and 4x98 for model 40571. 

 

All of this is why (a.) I bought a good PCD measuring tool, and (b.) had the two 4x98’s re-drilled to 4x100.

 

A Campy in Italy is assumed to be 4x98. A Campy in Germany is assumed to be 4x100. But 66.67% of my Italian Ragno’s were 4x100. Is that a meaningful statistic? Hell no, but it’s something...?

 

Regards,

 

Steve

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Conserv
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1976 2002 Polaris, 2742541 (original owner)

1973 2002tii Inka, 2762757 (not-the-original owner)

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Again, I'm not sure of value and so I was hoping to find out a reference of a recent sale. I will wait and watch the BAT wheels. Yes, mine are 100% 4x100 because they came on a 2002. I do remember one difference that they were 13x6 and not 13x5.5 like these other than being 4x100.

I will eventually dig them out and post some photos.

Edited by resra
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8 minutes ago, resra said:

Yes, mine are 100% 4x100 because they came on a 2002.

 

 

So if PCD is determined by the most recent car on which a rim was installed, that makes 100% of my six Ragno’s 4x98, because they were last on Fiats.

 

But four of the six were 4x100 and only two were 4x98. Facts are so....annoying! ?

 

As to models 40714 and 40571, both are, indeed, 5 1/2” rims. The 6” rims have their own model numbers and the dual usage of a single casting for multiple models may or may not apply.

 

Regardless, there is never a downside to checking a rim with a good PCD measuring tool. I’ve found 4x98’s in too many places! ?

 

Regards,

 

Steve

 

 

 

1976 2002 Polaris, 2742541 (original owner)

1973 2002tii Inka, 2762757 (not-the-original owner)

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1 hour ago, Conserv said:

I’ve found 4x98’s in too many places!

+1

 

I've been watching the Italian's equivalent of Craig's List for about two years now looking for a spare wheel for my set.  There are multiple sets of 4x98 campys for sale at any time.  4x100, not so much.

 

Also, I am extremely wary of unknown restoration of campys.  I prefer to find unrestored set with the labels below and go from there.

 

image.png.a47a78659edd36e1ad9830b8bc740454.pngimage.png.69495783acbad1c7862a33c31f4ede97.png

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Around 2005,  I bought a set of old school 13" Campagnolos from Carl Nelson's shop in San Diego when I lived in So Cal. The wheels needed refinishing but when I took the Campy's to wheel shops to get a quote on restoration, not a single wheel shop that I contacted in So Cal would touch them.  No one wanted to deal with magnesium wheels.  Luckily I sold them to a fellow 02 enthusiast for what I paid for them ($200).  Magnesium wheel restoration is a lost art.

 

G-Man

 

 

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74 tii (many mods)
91 318i M42

07 4Runner

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4 hours ago, Gordon said:

....not a single wheel shop that I contacted in So Cal would touch them.  No one wanted to deal with magnesium wheels.  Luckily I sold them to a fellow 02 enthusiast for what I paid for them ($200).  Magnesium wheel restoration is a lost art.

 

G-Man

 

 

 

+1

 

Yes, absolutely!

 

And I went to great efforts — and, oh yes, expense, too — to have mine restored with gentle media blasting and correct painting by a fellow who specialized in restoring Campy’s and Cromodora’s for Ferrari’s.

 

But I must admit that the majority of Campy owners I meet drop their Campy’s off at the powder coater — 400-degree oven be damned — and never seem to have any problems or issues. So I don’t know how much all this “magnesium sensitivity” is an unfounded leftover from the “good old days”, when “mag” wheels were mostly magnesium, not alloys....

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

Edited by Conserv

1976 2002 Polaris, 2742541 (original owner)

1973 2002tii Inka, 2762757 (not-the-original owner)

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9 hours ago, Tsingtao_1903 said:

+1

 

I've been watching the Italian's equivalent of Craig's List for about two years now looking for a spare wheel for my set.  There are multiple sets of 4x98 campys for sale at any time.  4x100, not so much.

 

Also, I am extremely wary of unknown restoration of campys.  I prefer to find unrestored set with the labels below and go from there.

 

image.png.a47a78659edd36e1ad9830b8bc740454.pngimage.png.69495783acbad1c7862a33c31f4ede97.png

 

+1

 

Labeled rims are certainly the best route, but they’re also rare, certainly well under half of the surviving rims retain their original paper labels.

 

But, also, as I mentioned above, nearly 100% of un-labeled Campy’s in Italy are assumed to be 4x98. And no one in the country owns a PCD measuring tool....?

 

And as I also mentioned, two of my rims — I bought all of my Campy’s in Italy — were advertised as 4x108, but both of these were 4x100. And two of the other four, coming off Fiats, were actually 4x100.

 

Regards,

 

Steve

 

 

 

 

1976 2002 Polaris, 2742541 (original owner)

1973 2002tii Inka, 2762757 (not-the-original owner)

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37 minutes ago, Conserv said:

 

 And no one in the country owns a PCD measuring tool....?

 

 

Regards,

 

Steve

 

 

 

 

But I have eight of those!

 

:D

Ray

Stop reading this! Don't you have anything better to do?? :P
Two running things. Two broken things.

 

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8 hours ago, ray_ said:

But I have eight of those!

 

 

And I have three, or four. We should pool our extras and ship them to places where PCD measuring tools are....under-represented.... ?

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

1976 2002 Polaris, 2742541 (original owner)

1973 2002tii Inka, 2762757 (not-the-original owner)

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4 minutes ago, ray_ said:

But mine are mounted to the cars. All I do to measure is slide the wheel on. It's a binary result! 

 

?

 

Yes, but.... a 4x98 will fit over 4x100 lugs, and vice versa. Thus, one of your binary results might be a “false positive”...  Or is that a “false negative”?  ???

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

Edited by Conserv

1976 2002 Polaris, 2742541 (original owner)

1973 2002tii Inka, 2762757 (not-the-original owner)

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1 hour ago, ray_ said:

Are you suggesting one would be hard-pressed to notice the difference? In theory I'm not sure I agree ?

 

Yes, and no, Ray,

 

Both PCD’s “appear” to fit on an ‘02. If I was not “PCD aware” — and I was absolutely, positively, NOT “PCD aware” 20, 30, or 40 years ago — I’d just torque down those lug nuts and go racing off. The opposing lug holes are only 2mm closer, and you miss the fact that tightening the lug nuts is placing extraordinary stress on the outer edges of the 4x98 lug holes when you torque down those lug nuts.

 

So I’d bet dollars to donuts that many “mistakes” were made and rims were swapped unwittingly, or knowingly, between 4x98 and 4x100 cars. One of my best buddies had a new Fiat 124 spider with BWA’s during the early ‘70’s. I would have thought “What a wonderful coincidence that your Fiat BWA’s fit my 2002!” and never looked back.

 

But I do believe, at least now, that rims and tires are critical to safety and wouldn’t run 4x98 rims on a 4x100 car unless I had the 4x98 rims re-drilled.

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

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1976 2002 Polaris, 2742541 (original owner)

1973 2002tii Inka, 2762757 (not-the-original owner)

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