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Wheel spacers, hub rings, and wheel shake? SOS


SmoresTM

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Tonight I finally installed my new set of wheels. 15x7 and 15x8 Gotti 150s. In order to get them to hook up I needed extended press in studs and spacers. 8mm up front, 15mm in the rear. Rear spacers are hub centric, but fronts are not. Everything from Ireland Engineering and everything went pretty well... until I started driving. The steering wheel shakes like it’s trying to escape the car.
 
I spoke to my friend who has more experience with this kind of thing and he said the problem was the front spacers. Being that they aren’t hub centric, they’re destined to shake and he recommended returning them. I’ve bought from IE on countless occasions and it struck me as uncharacteristic that they’d produce or sell a product with such issues, but when I looked back on their site it seemed to be because such a small spacer cannot be made hub centric due to the 2002 hub itself. So I started looking at hub rings but honestly I don’t know much about them and have never had a use for them before. I’m going to measure the center bore of the wheels soon. Because they’re so uncommon, no information is readily available online that I was able to find. If anyone has any suggestions, I’m all ears. New spacers? Hub rings? Throw it all in the bin?
 
On the bright side, they look great and will fit nicely once I install my coil overs.
 
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Thanks in advance
Sam
 
 
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-Sam

1976 Pastellblau Project

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The 2002 suspension is not hubcentric, so that's a moot point.

 

If you have e21 components, they are- but I've run 25mm of spacer up front

with very little vibration up to 100mph.

 

And a spacer so thin as to be unable to support a hub flange just shouldn't cause trouble.

 

What nuts do these wheels use?  I've had some issues with straight shank (mag) nuts

 

Start diagnosing as you would any shake- jack the car up and

watch the wheel spin, both the tread and tge rim edges.

.  It'll show you what's going on.

Wobbling like that really sounds like something's dimensionally off.

They're not 4x98, are they?

 

hth,

t

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"I learn best through painful, expensive experience, so I feel like I've gotten my money's worth." MattL

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You didn't mention balancing.   Do you trust the shop that balanced your wheels?  Weights can fall off, or get torn off by calipers if placed poorly.

 

17 minutes ago, TobyB said:

What nuts do these wheels use?  I've had some issues with straight shank (mag) nuts

 

Me too.  My wheels use mag nuts.  I use hubcentric rings up front to ensure that the wheels are going on straight.  With a good balance, I have no vibration.  With a bad balance or missing weights I've had crazy vibration.

Edited by PaulTWinterton

73 Inka Tii #2762958

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41 minutes ago, TobyB said:

 

What nuts do these wheels use?  I've had some issues with straight shank (mag) nuts

 

Start diagnosing as you would any shake- jack the car up and

watch the wheel spin, both the tread and tge rim edges.

.  It'll show you what's going on.

Wobbling like that really sounds like something's dimensionally off.

They're not 4x98, are they?

 

hth,

t

 

Wheels use tapered nuts. I'll double check the angle but I was pretty certain they're the same as the tapered nuts IE sent me. Definitely not 4x98 though, they came off of another 4x100 car with no issues. I'm going to investigate further tonight, hopefully something will come of it. Perhaps one of the press in studs didn't press in all the way and is causing the hub not to sit flush? We shall see. 

-Sam

1976 Pastellblau Project

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28 minutes ago, PaulTWinterton said:

You didn't mention balancing.   Do you trust the shop that balanced your wheels?  Weights can fall off, or get torn off by calipers if placed poorly.

 

 

Me too.  My wheels use mag nuts.  I use hubcentric rings up front to ensure that the wheels are going on straight.  With a good balance, I have no vibration.  With a bad balance or missing weights I've had crazy vibration.

 

I work at a restoration shop and used the same people the shop uses. They've always been great but I'll make sure none of them have fallen off. I'll get some hub centric rings for good measure, but will see if I can track down the issue tonight.

-Sam

1976 Pastellblau Project

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I bought wheels with a PCD of 4 x 4" when (as you know) ours are 4 x 100mm. I decided to use wobble nuts, which meant  needed hubcentric spacers. I had the problem of the wheels having an offset of -5mm (being 7j x 13" diameter) so I couldn't buy any; they were all too thick.

 

I actually made my own with 16swg laser cut discs with the correct diameter tube welded to them. I got them within 0.2mm centre and they've done the job. Up to 70mph anyway ? 

IMG_0439 copy.jpg

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7 hours ago, AndySals said:

I bought wheels with a PCD of 4 x 4" when (as you know) ours are 4 x 100mm. I decided to use wobble nuts, which meant  needed hubcentric spacers. I had the problem of the wheels having an offset of -5mm (being 7j x 13" diameter) so I couldn't buy any; they were all too thick.

 

I actually made my own with 16swg laser cut discs with the correct diameter tube welded to them. I got them within 0.2mm centre and they've done the job. Up to 70mph anyway ? 

IMG_0439 copy.jpg

 

Nothing a little bit of custom fabrication can't fix! What wheels were you running? I'd be curious to see them on the car.

 

Turns out my problem was simpler than I though. Seems a manufacture error, but easy enough to correct by increasing the size of the spacers' center bore. Luckily a buddy of mine at work knows how to use the lathe, because that is a bit outside of my skillset. Still has a subtle wobble at speed, but worlds better...

 

Now I just need a GPS speedometer, because good god that thing is way off. 

-Sam

1976 Pastellblau Project

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As Toby says, your problem is not the spacers.

 

Old multi-piece wheels can be troublesome (but I love those Gotti's, yours look great), I too would tend towards exploring the wheel balance first.  Were Gotti's originally face mounted like you have though?  If not, were the rear of the faces machined to accept both the lip and barrel? 

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Currently doing an Alpina lip install. The wheels are J A Pierce Magnesium 
9FDB41A5-65E6-4607-9196-45E9852F5E23.thumb.jpeg.3b2b4563f9e8b0cb93a0e1eb0116fe33.jpeg
6BC042E9-E690-4885-BF11-7DCF4E5FD444.thumb.jpeg.976088d974cf7b62ceec2755692e4926.jpeg
BA055D3B-7F07-47D5-B003-30674519E0C1.thumb.jpeg.04d4141d04b5185c139b6842124aab79.jpeg


Those looks great! They look like something that could have come on a factory Turbo. Love it!


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-Sam

1976 Pastellblau Project

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As Toby says, your problem is not the spacers.
 
Old multi-piece wheels can be troublesome (but I love those Gotti's, yours look great), I too would tend towards exploring the wheel balance first.  Were Gotti's originally face mounted like you have though?  If not, were the rear of the faces machined to accept both the lip and barrel? 


While you’re absolutely right about multi-piece wheels being occasionally troublesome, this time it actually was the spacer this time (mostly). The center bore for the spacers was just slightly too small so they wouldn’t seat quite right. I mean, maybe a millimeter off. Small enough that I didn’t notice but more than enough to make my wheels feel like they were going to shake off. I had a friend at work machine them out on the lathe. So much better. I still notice a small vibration at highway speed, but honestly the car needs new tie rods and an alignment anyways so hopefully that’ll take care of that!


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-Sam

1976 Pastellblau Project

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I got rid of my shake by tightening the castellated nut about 3 degrees.
 
[emoji6]


It’s funny, mine castellated nuts were barely even hand tight the first time I took the hubs off of this car. I always worry about over-tightening things, but I can rest easy knowing I’m the one who put them back on. When I installed the extended press in studs I made damn sure those nuts were tight.


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-Sam

1976 Pastellblau Project

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5 minutes ago, SmoresTM said:

 


It’s funny, mine castellated nuts were barely even hand tight the first time I took the hubs off of this car. I always worry about over-tightening things, but I can rest easy knowing I’m the one who put them back on. When I installed the extended press in studs I made damn sure those nuts were tight.


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I hope that you checked the slotted washer underneath was loose and can float a bit. This allows your bearings to expand when hot. 

rtheriaque wrote:

Carbs: They're necessary and barely controlled fuel leaks that sometimes match the air passing through them.

My build blog:http://www.bmw2002faq.com/blog/163-simeons-blog/

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