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What makes 2002 an Alpina


alan717

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There were a couple of dodgy BMW dealers in the UK who used to buy parts from Alpina, unfortunately they used to fit them to the 02's they sold and called them Alpina's, when Alpina found out they refused to let them have anymore parts, I think the principle also get in a spot of bother with BMW, my understanding is they also tried it on with Hartge as well.

A family member had an A4s and it was an awesome little car for its time, had most of the A4 bits, but this one was a dodgy, didn't change how well it went.

i wouldn't badge a non Alpina as one as it's just not, but I'd sure as hell use the bits.

To me the principal is your car your way, if it's a fake, clone, tribute so what as long as the owner is honest about it who cares, I'd love it almost the same?

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Alpina was since foundation to mid e21 era just a tuner(even later you could buy almost anything as a spare). You could order Alpina engine on a pallet, you could order a kit A0 or A1 and local BMW service could bolt it on and tune it in. Also Alpina had a few shops in Europe that assambled parts. A real Alpina is the one with all the paperwork about work done, the recent one A4s (sold as 195HP but was actually 175) had a full paper documentation but a lot of parts that alpina installed were gone and some were added. If 10% of real Alpina cars(A2 till A4s) now have documentation that is a lot. A lot of A0 and A1 were just a kit added on local BMW services, just carburetor numbers and maybe other parts added is a clue to guess that maybe this car is an Alpina.
But if you make a race Alpina car, there in no way that this could be real one, race car needs a racing history otherwise just a clone.

Best regards

Blaz

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On 3/21/2017 at 11:51 AM, Conserv said:

It's probably not an Alpina unless the car went to Bovensiepen and had Alpina make some mods.  The mods could be as minor as some suspension mods: the customer dictated what he/she wanted.  There was a recent BAT sale of a 1972 2000tii touring model that was bona fide Alpina car, replete with documents showing a new 2000tii being sent to Alpina, moderately modified -- primarily suspension, brakes, and rims -- and then sold to the initial owner.  Note: it looks nothing like your Colorado and black sample!

 

 

But I think you may be conflating an Alpina car with an Alpina-prepared racing car.

 

I'd recommend, assuming you do create a "tribute" Alpina-prepared racing car, as in your photo, that you ALWAYS refer to it as a tribute, facsimile, or whatever, as very bad words will be heaped upon you if you pretend for one second that it is the real thing!

 

Good luck and regards,

 

Steve

 

 Yes you are totally correct I was kind of confusing the Alpina race cars with an Alpina car. After reading more on the subject and various posts that is what I would love to have a copy of that Alpina race car for street use. 

1974 2002 Amazon green

1972 2002 Colorado Orange, smashed nose #2579332

1995 Toyota T-100 p/u white

1995 MZ silver star w/sidecar...currently being modified

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On 3/21/2017 at 0:25 PM, zinz said:

Yes... I share the dream of building a pigcheek Alpina tribute car someday.  ( I shoulda bought/finished Koupe's car...grrrr...) 

 

Without an Alpina build plate or solid provenance... well, it's just an '02 with Alpina parts on it and that is okay.  Miller Norburn and Hardy&Beck sold those aftermarket pieces on the open market and you can find cars with those pieces still today.  Collectors treasure those pieces and we see Alpina "tribute" cars just about every year. There are lots of repro Alpina parts and very few folks know the difference.  (I have been fooled plenty of times but FAQ gurus have helped me out before I've spent my hard-earned $$).  

 

Good info here:

 

I'm with Joel and the others... build it as well as you can and enjoy it.  Haters will hate, but most of us will appreciate your efforts.

 

Ed Z

 

Hello Ed,

 I will do a search but where can I find more about that Koupe's car you mentioned, I'd like to  see what he did. 

1974 2002 Amazon green

1972 2002 Colorado Orange, smashed nose #2579332

1995 Toyota T-100 p/u white

1995 MZ silver star w/sidecar...currently being modified

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I'll dig up some pics, but he had collected the choicest bits... I was shy of $$ at the time and he had to sell it before he could finish it. New owner apparently had the skills and wherewithal to finish it correctly. Never knew how far he got. 

 

Some of my fave Google pics:

 

image.jpeg.69fd605846eb43d434b82539a60371fa.jpeg

image.jpeg.aecdf10bf70091c54726d50f39936de3.jpeg

image.thumb.jpeg.0c74058f950f2831e76d67588700f207.jpeg

 

...someday

Ed

'69 Granada... long, long ago  

'71 Manila..such a great car

'67 Granada 2000CS...way cool

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ALPINA built cars to order and customers could order a brand new 2002 from Bovensiepen. The order process was extensively documented by ALPINA with a lengthy order confirmation followed by preliminary build sheet confirmation then a final build sheet showing exact equipment and specs accompanied by a dynamometer sheet and of course an invoice for the final tally.

 

This pic shows ALPINA docs related to one such car:  a new 2002 built to customer specs image.thumb.jpeg.2d9c620d1302f8c2fe8ad9cfcacfba88.jpegin 1974.

 

Documentation of this sort defines an ALPINA built car.

 

For those 02s registered in Germany and modified with ALPINA parts subsequent to original delivery, every mechanical modification would be listed on the vehicles TUV papers. So if your 1600 had ALPINA steel wheels or even a smaller diameter ALPINA steering wheel,  the TUV inspector would so note the modification on the permanent registration papers for the vehicle.

 

 

 

Edited by Flunder
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This Alpina thing today is a kind of internet myth, a revision of actual history, and seems to be, more so in the US than in Europe where, at the time, Alpina were seen as just another tuning company. They certainly had a good marketing strategy. 

 

To the best of my knowledge a genuine Alpina, re-manufactured by Alpina, would have Alpina badges on it. There would be no BMW badge to be seen. None on the boot, bonnet, steering wheel or road wheels.

02tii 2751928 (2582)

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3 hours ago, JohnH said:

To the best of my knowledge a genuine Alpina, re-manufactured by Alpina, would have Alpina badges on it. There would be no BMW badge to be seen. None on the boot, bonnet, steering wheel or road wheels.

No, for sure. Some samples of racecars of different periods. Alpina is car manufacturer since 1983!

Kopie von 0000295415.jpg

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Stuck04.jpg

0000360433.jpg

0000289270.jpg

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This topic has been posted a number of times over the years - never really thought too much about it (before).  At various points in time over the years I own or have owned virtually every part AlpinA offered for a BmW 2oo2.  My 73tii that I ripped around Newport Beach in had a good number of those parts on it including an A4 spec motor with correct 129.10 pump.  For me personally it is pretty simple.  It is a true AlpinA car if it has an AlpinA build sheet (ideally built at AlpinA or an authorized partner).  Otherwise it is a BmW car with AlpinA parts of some combination.  Of course this is just my personal opinion - if i were either buying or selling a car it would be my view.

 

As far as "BmW" badges on cars, I am nearly certain back in the 70's that AlpinA had NOT developed roundel's to replace the BmW Roundel's on the hood, deck lid or back panel.  The Malaga car is an A4 that AlpinA built and used in a number of press releases including an article in Sport Auto (I think it was).  My AlpinA Gr. 2 car had the same BmW Roundels front/back, but of course had "BMW ALPINA" graphics in a number of locations....

BMW-2002-Alpina-Bild-02.jpg

imauuuuxy.php.jpg

Edited by markmac
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Variations on a theme...

 

 

CosmicWheels.jpg

1973 2002tii - gone

Inka (aka "Orange Julius")

#2762756

1974 2002tii - gone

Polaris (aka "Mae West")

#2782824

1991 318is (aka) "O'Hara")

Brillantrot - High Visibility Daily Driver

BMW CCA #1974 (one of the 308)

deliawolfe@gmail.com

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image.thumb.jpg.ab26d01da8bcc446b0fd8d742727a63f.jpgThe above image shows  the official BMW-ALPINA company stamp used on invoices during the era of the 1600 and 2002.

 

Below, a close up of the NK stylized badge used on the company letterhead during this time shows that that the company absolutely identified itself as "BMW-ALPINA."

 

The liberal use of the BMW name and trademarks in the BMW-ALPINA company's letterhead and invoices (as well as race car livery as WHS shows in his post)image.thumb.jpg.6a60bf2c9ff358252f7186d7563c7ea6.jpgdemonstrates just how special a relationship they enjoyed during the early years. In the eyes of BMW at least, Burkard Bovensiepen was viewed as perhaps  a bit more than just another tuner.

 

Edited by Flunder
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Given how protective BMW is about their name and logo the fact that Alpina was allowed to use it on their letter head does support a relationship of some note between the two companys.

If everybody in the room is thinking the same thing, then someone is not thinking.

 

George S Patton 

Planning the Normandy Break out 1944

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1 hour ago, Delia said:

Variations on a theme...

 

 

CosmicWheels.jpg

Thats a cool photo Delia. Thanks

1974 2002 Amazon green

1972 2002 Colorado Orange, smashed nose #2579332

1995 Toyota T-100 p/u white

1995 MZ silver star w/sidecar...currently being modified

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43 minutes ago, Son of Marty said:

Given how protective BMW is about their name and logo the fact that Alpina was allowed to use it on their letter head does support a relationship of some note between the two companys.

Perhaps BMW's trademark protectiveness accounts for the change that occurred at some point between mid 1974 and early 1976 when the ALPINA company adopted a new trademark of its own that made no mention of BMW and which did not display the roundel. Here is the new, but now familiar, ALPINA trademark used on the company"s letterhead on correspondence dated image.thumb.jpg.21050c60ce56dbb8b0949ad82f12e781.jpgMarch 1976.

Edited by Flunder
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