burndog

205 / 50 / 15

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I was waiting for you Marshall, like a moth to a flame... J/K.

 

You and I had exchanged a correspondence about this over a year ago. You had mentioned that the actual width between 195 and 205 was negligible an not necessarily worth the effort / pain in the ass. Is a .5" (1/4" each side) of tread patch worth the potential can of worms??? 

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195s with ET28 and front coilover/camber plates cleared by so little that I wouldn't have tried 205's.

They hit front valence and rear inner fender at locks, so I figured that was good enuf.

 

t

anything to avoid bumping the <<shudder>> stants thred

Edited by TobyB

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That was my sentiment also and I can see that at full lock I have been ever so slightly rubbing on the Strut / spring. What about the rears, with the same offset it seems like the 205 would tuck in ever so nicely, but close. I have a .5" in clearance from tire to inner fender lip and almost .75" clearance to the strut at full compression.

 

Just need to know will the 205's rub before I pull the trigger??? And I could also open this up to using the SDrives or the Dunlop Direzza ZII StarSpec? 25.00 difference per tire, does that buy you a better performing tire in the Dunlop?

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I went through this dilemma earlier in the year. My wheels are et29ish 15x7's, I went 205/50's in the rear and 195/50's up front on S Drives. The 195's require a 5mm spacer to clear the strut and I would expect the 205's up front would need at least 10mm to clear the strut, my guess is that I dont think you will be able to make the 205's happen without some massaging. If you haven't made a decision by Sunday night I'll swap one of the 205's to the front and see how it fits. A lot of people (including myself) have asked this 205 tire question and the answer I heard most was that it isn't a perfect science. Maybe it's better with the new website but it was also impossible to get proper results for "205/50r15" lol.

 

205's fit nice in the rear, if you want to tuck the tires you may need to roll the fenders slightly but I wouldn't hesitate on 205's in the rear with proper ET wheels. 

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6 hours ago, burndog said:

That was my sentiment also and I can see that at full lock I have been ever so slightly rubbing on the Strut / spring. What about the rears, with the same offset it seems like the 205 would tuck in ever so nicely, but close. I have a .5" in clearance from tire to inner fender lip and almost .75" clearance to the strut at full compression.

 

Just need to know will the 205's rub before I pull the trigger??? And I could also open this up to using the SDrives or the Dunlop Direzza ZII StarSpec? 25.00 difference per tire, does that buy you a better performing tire in the Dunlop?

 

My tii has fender flares, so 205s are a perfect fit :)

 

Because your 02 is so modified, I would strongly advocate going for more grip whenever possible. I am fully aware of the appeal of a stock-ish 02 on old-school, skinny tires and low handling limits. They are incredibly fun in that state. When I first bought my car a few years ago (with fender flares already installed), the 15x7 wheels had 205/50R-15 Yoko AVS-ES100s (the predecessor to the S-Drive) that were almost 10 years old. It was certainly fun to slide around, and I initially considered S-Drives as replacement tires. But, ultimate grip won out and I got Bridgestone Potenza RE-11As and didn't look back. The S-Drive is high-performance all-season tire, while the RE-11A (and Direzza ZII Star Spec) is an "extreme summer" tire that is at home at a racetrack or autocross course.

 

With only 130-ish horsepower, it can be difficult to get the rear end to break loose on the street, but the steering response and cornering grip of a proper "extreme summer" tire is amazing. But perhaps the best attribute of sticky tires is braking grip---at least one dog that  suddenly ran out in the middle of the road owes its life to the grip of those RE-11As (and because I can threshold brake without locking up----track experience is valuable!).

 

Of course, the RE-11As only lasted 6-7K miles on my 2002tii (street only), but I got my money's worth. I hoped to replace them with the successive Bridgestone RE-71R after positive experience with those on my Porsche 944 Turbo track/street car (now on Pirelli Trofeo Rs :), but they were on backorder so I went with the Direzza ZII Star Spec instead (I had 7-8 sets of the original Star Specs on my 944, and a set or two of the ZII and they were amazing dual-purpose street and track tires). The downsides are that they wear out quickly, and can be incredibly noisy during normal street driving after they have gone through a track day (the RE-71Rs are the same way, but the now-discontinued RE-11As were fairly quiet).

 

Anyway, the choice is yours, but it's a pretty easy one if you know what your priorities are!

 

Chris

 

 

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Currently have 205 15's mit et25 offset BBS RS001's on lowered susp.

 

Rears tuck in nicely and have no rubbing issues.

 

Fronts I installed Fixed camber plates, and required me to do significant fender rolling and pulling to clear 75% of situations.  They will rub close to full lock, or when in a tight corner driving hard. The occasional mid-corner bump compression can insight a bit of rub.

 

The tires came used with the rims, so that's the only reason I've been running them. I'll be doing 195's soon to remedy that last 25% of rubbing. 

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I run 195's on 15x7 et24 and they just touch the lip in the rear on really hard corners and the fronts hit the fender lips on good bumps, big corners. 205 wouldn't fit on my stock car.

 

I also prefer the S.Drives. My dad has some older (6 years) Direzza's on his Miata and I am personally not a fan of them. I also am not a big fan of the BFG Sport Comp 2's, they have no rim protector where as the S.Drives do. I'm positive this helped a lot! I've dented at least one rim with the BFG's in 5000 miles. No dents with the S.Drives in 25,000 miles.

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Also always remember that 205s are NOT all the same widths (and diameters).  Tire brands can make a difference, esp. if you're trying for a tight fitment.  That's why offset and wheel width alone aren't enough to pin it down - and why folks have varying results (along with 40yo car variations).

 

In just same aspect ratio "205s" when I was shopping - tire section width could vary up to 0.5" and tread width could vary by up to 1.0" (!) across brands.

 

Tom

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5 hours ago, visionaut said:

Also always remember that 205s are NOT all the same widths (and diameters).  Tire brands can make a difference, esp. if you're trying for a tight fitment.  That's why offset and wheel width alone aren't enough to pin it down - and why folks have varying results (along with 40yo car variations).

 

In just same aspect ratio "205s" when I was shopping - tire section width could vary up to 0.5" and tread width could vary by up to 1.0" (!) across brands.

 

Tom

 

THIS.

 

One of my favorite budget performance tires is the Federal RSRs. They are also some of the widest, most square shouldered treads you can get.

 

I had 245 toyos on my Subaru that came with the wheels I bought, (notice a trend?? It's always a great deal to buy used rim/tire combos :) ) And they required a fair amount of rolling and pulling to work. 

 

So when those wore out I decided to go RSR's, but got 235's, and they ended up being WIDER across the tread than the 245's! I got reaaaaallly good at fender rolling and pulling. Let alone cutting some sheetmetal out of the rear arches to make them work. 

 

I'm going to get the Federals again for my 02 next, and, keeping my previous experience in mind, I'm going to do a whole bunch of homework to see if I need to step down even further to fit. 

Edited by 2002Scoob

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On 6/21/2016 at 5:57 PM, burndog said:

I was waiting for you Marshall, like a moth to a flame... J/K.

 

You and I had exchanged a correspondence about this over a year ago. You had mentioned that the actual width between 195 and 205 was negligible an not necessarily worth the effort / pain in the ass. Is a .5" (1/4" each side) of tread patch worth the potential can of worms??? 

If performance is the goal and not a look,  then buy the best tire in a 195.  Width is a secondary consideration to tread compound.  Eg...205 federals may be cheap and wide,  but they suck compared to real performance tires in 195. 

 

And always check the specs on a site like tirerack.com.  tires marked the same by different manufacturers are not the same size. 

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Ps - chris...the s.drive is NOT an all season tire....it is a performance SUMMER tire.

 

And the es100 was probably the worst tire I have ever used.

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Ps - chris...the s.drive is NOT an all season tire....it is a performance SUMMER tire.

 

Agreed. Under about 40F, the S-drive starts to get a little sketchy. But sort of predictably so. The first time happens it will get your attention.

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3 hours ago, mlytle said:

Ps - chris...the s.drive is NOT an all season tire....it is a performance SUMMER tire.

 

And the es100 was probably the worst tire I have ever used.

 

Ha, could have fooled me! The S-Drive seems to be a popular tire, and a number of my customers run them on '80s Porsche 911s, etc. They are decent, but don't have a ton of grip. I guess I am a tire snob!

 

And yes, the rock-hard AVS-ES100s that were on my car when I bought it were great for drifting, and not much else!

 

3 hours ago, Chamonix72 said:

Agreed. Under about 40F, the S-drive starts to get a little sketchy. But sort of predictably so. The first time happens it will get your attention.

 

That is better than the 60 degrees F threshold of the Hankook RS3, which had a lot of grip for a very cheap price, but had all of the downsides of a true R-compound tire. As in they were also terrible in the wet, unlike the Dunlop and Bridgestone tires mentioned in my previous post. Nonetheless, I did buy two sets of those for my 944 because the price was so attractive and they were great during warm-weather track days, soft-ish sidewalls notwithstanding . . . . 

 

On 6/22/2016 at 9:09 PM, roadhog0 said:

I also prefer the S.Drives. My dad has some older (6 years) Direzza's on his Miata and I am personally not a fan of them. I also am not a big fan of the BFG Sport Comp 2's, they have no rim protector where as the S.Drives do. I'm positive this helped a lot! I've dented at least one rim with the BFG's in 5000 miles. No dents with the S.Drives in 25,000 miles.

 

Not sure which Direzzas are on your dad's Miata, but there are "lesser" Direzzas such as the DZ101, which are the equivalent of the Yoko S-Drive (not to mention, 6 years old is getting up there, regardless of tire type/compound). The track-worthy, "extreme summer" Direzzas that are referenced in this thread are Star Specs, which have a pictogram of a star shape on the sidewall. The difference in grip between the Z1 or ZII Star Specs and the DZ101 is night and day . . . . . but you will pay for it terms of the rate of treadwear!

 

Chris

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