M20 Swap Pics Thread

[Meintii]

bump

[-=Charley]

per request:

random:

[Meintii]

bump again

[Pierre]

I don't buy the argument that reverting to an M10 may be the reason not to cut, or that the car should be kept original.

If that is an important consideration, then an M20 conversion is not recommended. An M20 is not original and going back to an M10 will not happen. Why would anyone go back from an M20 to an M10?

[1969Black2002]

drool.

[tjones02]

I don't buy the argument that reverting to an M10 may be the reason not to cut, or that the car should be kept original.

If that is an important consideration, then an M20 conversion is not recommended. An M20 is not original and going back to an M10 will not happen. Why would anyone go back from an M20 to an M10?

So Pierre, in your heart of hearts you truly don't believe that these cars will be worth enough one day that reverting to a stock restored M10 will make the car worth more. In this vision of mine I see guys/gals restoring some of these M20 cars back to original because they are restoring the car, because the value is on par with an equivalent Alfa or Porsche....

I say this as we are gearing up to do two M20 swaps, one in a '76 '02 that will end up having to go to the CA BAR Referee for a sticker thus have to pass smog and another in a '72 Tii. Sean and I are conspiring to do these without cutting the nose of either car, especially the original owner Tii (no not my Dad's but another customer). I know it can and has been done before, mainly with early M20s that had the distributor in the block and a shorter water pump...

These are 35+ year old somewhat historic cars who's values are on the rise... I think it's time to stop doing irreversible (unnecessary) hacking of them. Hack up the bolt in/on parts all you want, but leave the body alone.

OK, purist idealist rant over. :b...

[creede]

[bourkeco]

I dont see the need to do a M20 swap except for the look at me cool factor... The m10 block can take just about any amount of horsepower you can put through it. With all of the new Tech.. for the M10.. there is very little reason for all the effort ... Im not knocking anyone my car is anything but stock.

[75duce]

To make a m10 with 170 hp is going to take a lot of money and it going to

be a grenade . The m20 2.5 makes 170 stock

[ndog]

^that is sick stealth

[bourkeco]

To make a m10 with 170 hp is going to take a lot of money and it going to

be a grenade . The m20 2.5 makes 170 stock

A Grenade???? That is a bit dramitc... dont you think... even a well built 250-300hp is nothing close to a grenade... I do understand if you just want to drop in a big block but its not really more money to do one or the other Right!.... and I love your car!!! come out and join us for a track day, its tons of fun!!!

[tinkwithanr]

A few pics of my progress, should be done by the end of the summer:

[Pierre]

I don't buy the argument that reverting to an M10 may be the reason not to cut, or that the car should be kept original.

If that is an important consideration, then an M20 conversion is not recommended. An M20 is not original and going back to an M10 will not happen. Why would anyone go back from an M20 to an M10?

So Pierre, in your heart of hearts you truly don't believe that these cars will be worth enough one day that reverting to a stock restored M10 will make the car worth more. In this vision of mine I see guys/gals restoring some of these M20 cars back to original because they are restoring the car, because the value is on par with an equivalent Alfa or Porsche....

I say this as we are gearing up to do two M20 swaps, one in a '76 '02 that will end up having to go to the CA BAR Referee for a sticker thus have to pass smog and another in a '72 Tii. Sean and I are conspiring to do these without cutting the nose of either car, especially the original owner Tii (no not my Dad's but another customer). I know it can and has been done before, mainly with early M20s that had the distributor in the block and a shorter water pump...

These are 35+ year old somewhat historic cars who's values are on the rise... I think it's time to stop doing irreversible (unnecessary) hacking of them. Hack up the bolt in/on parts all you want, but leave the body alone.

OK, purist idealist rant over. :b...

You touched on several topics Tom.

The future of 2002 prices is hard to predict. Yes, the turbos and the tiis are getting more valuable but I personally don't see 2002s becoming outrageously valuable. I may be wrong.

Value is also relative. The amount of time, effort and expense spent in saving a nose panel and a subframe from being cut may not justify the value saved in protecting the car. Nose panels and subframes are replaceable anyway. But you have to cut the harness. Solder and shrink tube is an option when reverting back but it's now hacked.

Doing an M20 conversion is not for the purist. But I would venture to say that now and in the future, a 2002 in stock form with an M10 is worth less than a car in same physical condition with a stock M20 and a 5-speed.

I am not a purist. Some people are. That is the beauty of these cars. They can so versatile and can be so many things to so many people. The focus is to enjoy these cars the way we like them individually, not the way the future market might potentially decide. But if some people enjoy driving a "valuable" car because it's all original, or one that could be brought back to original condition, then by all means, enjoy.

[tjones02]

To make a m10 with 170 hp is going to take a lot of money and it going to

be a grenade.

Somewhat expensive yes but a grenade(?), not true by any means as long as it's professionally or otherwise well planed and built. It's just gonna cost a bit more than a dime a dozen junk yard M20B25 engine. But the trans for the M20 will cost you if you go for the proper 245 from a 323i, or build one from a 320i 245 and a 320/323i 4spd. That and getting a high HP M10 in the car doesn't cost anything extra.

Silly cast off M20s from E30 M50 swaps. Be a little bolder and build a 2.7 or larger M20 and stand out from the crowd.... Or be really bold and build a hot M10 or even a stroker M10. :b.....

[73colorado02]

Tom I can't say any more then you already have. I dont know if its because we both work for shops that perfer to do work that may take a little more work and time but will be right and look right when its done. I know it may be harder to not cut but my boss and I are both talking about the same topic and think we have figured out a way to make a 2.7 stroker fit in my car with out cutting anything. I will have to email you and bounce some ideas off ya about making them fit. Thanks Dylan.