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Stroked M10, S14 or other?


winstontj

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I realize that the holy grail seems to be an S14 swap into a 2002 however I'm not sure it would be worth the money, given the overall project and other motors available these days. 

 

I spent a lot of time (and money) collecting stuff so that I could have as many options as possible when the time came to restore this car. Now that the time has come I am second guessing the S14 build. I have two S14 motors, one with a cracked head and one with a cracked block. To make one S14 motor out of the two would probably be more expensive than if I were to buy an almost brand new B37/38 plus gearbox and swap that into my 2002

 

For those who have spent the time (and money) to put an S14 into a 2002, is it worth it? Would you do it again? 

 

Or perhaps just build a stroked M10 and be done with it?

 

Thoughts? 

 

'79 & '80 Vespas, R75/6 + R90/6 (and a Triumph), '76 IH Scout II

E36 

'71 VIN: 2574356 - Nevada, Sunroof, RUST and a really nice '76

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It depends what you want to do with your car.  If you plan to track your car, the S14 is a bit of a gamble.  On the one hand, it is basically a detuned race motor, and if properly cared for is quite robust.  On the other hand, if something does go wrong a rebuild is quite expensive.  I did the S14 swap, and it's hard to beat the cool factor of the S14.  But I did this years ago when the S14 was only slightly unreasonable.  Nowadays, if you wanted a track car I'd suggest turboing the m10, as the motors are robust and cheaper to rebuild if necessary.  However, if you want a cool street/weekend driver, it's hard to beat the S14 for the motorsports heritage, plus it seems like an evolution from the m10, and even most purists can appreciate it from the restomod perspective.

Ian
'76 M2

'02 325iT

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It won't be tracked. Initially I thought I might but now I'm leaning towards spec e36 for the track and even considering air conditioning for the 2002. If the 2002 ever sees the track it would be on an open track day or perhaps autox, not racing in a class. 

'79 & '80 Vespas, R75/6 + R90/6 (and a Triumph), '76 IH Scout II

E36 

'71 VIN: 2574356 - Nevada, Sunroof, RUST and a really nice '76

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Depending on where you are, spec e46 is at a good place in the cost/benefit curve.  

36's are getting old and beat, while 46's are still out there with trashed interiors

and decent motors.

 

That said, go M54 in the 2002, and then you only need to have one spare engine for

both the street and the race car!

 

t

"I learn best through painful, expensive experience, so I feel like I've gotten my money's worth." MattL

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You have to commit to an idea for your 2002. If you want a relatively fast 2002, an s14 will almost get you there. If you accept that 2002s are inherently slow but exceptionally fun at lower speeds, I'd say build up an m10 with the standard upgrades (high CR pistons, headwork, cam, carb, dizzy, maybe 2.3-2.5L crank) and a 5-speed. This will be an excellent little hot-rod set up, and cheaper to do an an s14, both in building and maintenance. 

 

I did a 1600 up once pretty intensively. It had all the goods and a fully built motor. I loved that car. It was quite the punchy little car, and I would often surprise those who drove or were driven in this specific car. It's what a 2002 should be. 

some cars

some motorcycles

some airplanes

some surfboards

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It won't be tracked. Initially I thought I might but now I'm leaning towards spec e36 for the track and even considering air conditioning for the 2002. If the 2002 ever sees the track it would be on an open track day or perhaps autox, not racing in a class.

Unless it is to be a full track car, I would skip the s14. A tweaked m10 or an m20 are far better options for a street car. M10 -cheaper, in character with the car and a whole lot of fun. M20 -cheaper, much better power in the street area of the curve than an s14.

If you are talking about trying to put ac in the 2002, then really don't bother with an s14. It is just expensive eye candy at that point.

Edited by mlytle

2xM3

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Depending on where you are, spec e46 is at a good place in the cost/benefit curve.  

36's are getting old and beat, while 46's are still out there with trashed interiors

and decent motors.

 

That said, go M54 in the 2002, and then you only need to have one spare engine for

both the street and the race car!

 

t

Does that mean if I'm a year or two away from racing I should start in on spec e90 to get ahead of the curve?

'79 & '80 Vespas, R75/6 + R90/6 (and a Triumph), '76 IH Scout II

E36 

'71 VIN: 2574356 - Nevada, Sunroof, RUST and a really nice '76

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If you are just starting racing, find out what the popular class of cars is at the track nearest you and get one of those. Racing is not fun if you have no one to race with.

And do a lot of track school days before you actually go for a racing school.

Btw, e36's are still the dominant cars in bmwcr. Outstanding as race cars, cheaper to maintain than newer 3ers and a joy to drive fast.

2xM3

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IF that's the way you want to go.

Up here, Se36 never existed.  But Se46 is really starting to take off, 

as Pro3 gets 'vintage'...  

and the E46 is mechanically very similar to the 36, 

with most of the problems fixed.

 

Above all, if you want to race, it's regional- look at what's having fun at the tracks you can reasonably get to.

 

 

 

 I should start in on spec e90 to get ahead of the curve?

 

Doubtful right now- too much crap on the cars, which are more problematic to make easily race- able.

 

But I've been wrong about things before.

 

t

"I learn best through painful, expensive experience, so I feel like I've gotten my money's worth." MattL

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and the E46 is mechanically very similar to the 36, 

 

it is actually completely different.  different suspension design, more electronics, fly by wire throttle, etc.  the e46 was a clean sheet design.

 

some issues from e36 avoided, more issues with e46's created.

2xM3

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the e46 was a clean sheet design.

Ummm... Marshall...   I'm not sayin' your momma's wearin' army boots, but...

 

I disagree.  

 

There was more change from the 2002 to the E21, the E21 to the E30, and the E30 to the E36.

 

Yes, the E36 and E46 are different. 

 

No, they're not THAT different.  Dimensions were tweaked, improved, and the front and rear suspension lower

attachment methods modified, but if you put the critical E36 and E46 parts next to each other, it's an evolution.

Lollipops, lower arms, rear suspension motion and points, all pretty much alike.  (window switches, very different)

 

I agree that the E46 sprouted electronics like we get moss, and certainly began to INTEGRATE system electronics better, 

but aside from that throttle, there was a LOT of continuous evolution from the first year of E36 through to

the second half of the E46.  It's cool, but stupidly frustrating to get the right MONTH part for your car...

 

And to the original point, if Spec36 is thriving where you are, certainly going that way's a win.

But SE46 is hardly any more expensive IF there's competition in your region.

 

All in fun,

 

t

"I learn best through painful, expensive experience, so I feel like I've gotten my money's worth." MattL

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For those who have spent the time (and money) to put an S14 into a 2002, is it worth it? Would you do it again?

 

Yes it's a nice engine. But prices nowadays i'd probably would go M42 -route ( 4 zyl is my more to my liking). Maybe give it a little tweak or two and be happy about it.

2002 -73 M2, 2002 -71 forced induction. bnr32 -91

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